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Post by Royale McRoyals on May 30, 2014 7:56:51 GMT -5
Rock, dead serious question:
Since you're constantly stating that people just "don't get it" or don't understand things because they have less or no experience with them, would it be fair to say to you that you don't get religion for the same reasons? You don't get the Bible because you don't read it, you don't understand God because you have no relationship with any deities?
You might reply, "Oh no, I understand religion is for crackpots cause I've been familiar with it/them my whole life." But it's pretty much the same thing as Francis saying he's familiar with hockey even if he thinks it's for idiots.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 8:02:11 GMT -5
Rock, dead serious question: Since you're constantly stating that people just "don't get it" or don't understand things because they have less or no experience with them, would it be fair to say to you that you don't get religion for the same reasons? You don't get the Bible because you don't read it, you don't understand God because you have no relationship with any deities? You might reply, "Oh no, I understand religion is for crackpots cause I've been familiar with it/them my whole life." But it's pretty much the same thing as Francis saying he's familiar with hockey even if he thinks it's for idiots. no i was raised a brainwashed catholic, i did it for nearly 20 years francis has never worn skates see the difference? |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 8:07:53 GMT -5
no i was raised a brainwashed catholic, i did it for nearly 20 years francis has never worn skates see the difference? I have worn skates perhaps i should have said "played a moment of ice hockey" either way my statement stands |
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Post by Royale McRoyals on May 30, 2014 8:27:03 GMT -5
perhaps i should have said "played a moment of ice hockey" either way my statement stands I think mine does too. I think I can say: You don't get it, because I don't think you've ever actually been a believer. You might have watched from the sidelines: you stood up when they said stand, you knelt when they said kneel, you might have sat in a catechism class or prayed a rosary or even gone to confession, but in my opinion -- as a believer for over 30 years -- you never actually "got it." |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 8:31:14 GMT -5
perhaps i should have said "played a moment of ice hockey" either way my statement stands I think mine does too. I think I can say: You don't get it, because I don't think you've ever actually been a believer. You might have watched from the sidelines: you stood up when they said stand, you knelt when they said kneel, you might have sat in a catechism class or prayed a rosary or even gone to confession, but in my opinion -- as a believer for over 30 years -- you never actually "got it." Hu, rock represents a newer trend in atheism...activistic atheism.... I'm more spiritual than religious...would probably be a Buddhist if I cared enough to fully learn the philosophy, but I don't... A fundamental difference between an atheist like me, and rock? I envy your faith.... Rock sees all that's bad with religion...the negative headlines, the scandals etc...but sees none of the good...for many church goers? It's less about god, than it is about community... |
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Post by Royale McRoyals on May 30, 2014 8:35:14 GMT -5
I think mine does too. I think I can say: You don't get it, because I don't think you've ever actually been a believer. You might have watched from the sidelines: you stood up when they said stand, you knelt when they said kneel, you might have sat in a catechism class or prayed a rosary or even gone to confession, but in my opinion -- as a believer for over 30 years -- you never actually "got it." Hu, rock represents a newer trend in atheism...activistic atheism.... I'm more spiritual than religious...would probably be a Buddhist if I cared enough to fully learn the philosophy, but I don't... A fundamental difference between an atheist like me, and rock? I envy your faith.... Rock sees all that's bad with religion...the negative headlines, the scandals etc...but sees none of the good...for many church goers? It's less about god, than it is about community... Fair point: MANY churches more closely resemble a social club than a community of faith. Can't deny all the evil that has been done in the world in the name of god/religion. Period. Shouldn't toss out all the good that's been done in the same name. |
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Post by redsoxworrld on May 30, 2014 8:37:53 GMT -5
Hu, rock represents a newer trend in atheism...activistic atheism.... I'm more spiritual than religious...would probably be a Buddhist if I cared enough to fully learn the philosophy, but I don't... A fundamental difference between an atheist like me, and rock? I envy your faith.... Rock sees all that's bad with religion...the negative headlines, the scandals etc...but sees none of the good...for many church goers? It's less about god, than it is about community... Fair point: MANY churches more closely resemble a social club than a community of faith. Can't deny all the evil that has been done in the world in the name of god/religion. Period. Shouldn't toss out all the good that's been done in the same name. huw since you are at least somewhat religious, can I ask you a question? Have you ever brought in any sheaves and what the hell are they if you have? used to watch Little House on the Prairie with my folks as a kid and every time there was a church scene they were always singing "Bringing in the Sheaves" |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 8:39:13 GMT -5
perhaps i should have said "played a moment of ice hockey" either way my statement stands I think mine does too. I think I can say: You don't get it, because I don't think you've ever actually been a believer. You might have watched from the sidelines: you stood up when they said stand, you knelt when they said kneel, you might have sat in a catechism class or prayed a rosary or even gone to confession, but in my opinion -- as a believer for over 30 years -- you never actually "got it." thats fair but i also dont believe in magic |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 8:45:45 GMT -5
I think mine does too. I think I can say: You don't get it, because I don't think you've ever actually been a believer. You might have watched from the sidelines: you stood up when they said stand, you knelt when they said kneel, you might have sat in a catechism class or prayed a rosary or even gone to confession, but in my opinion -- as a believer for over 30 years -- you never actually "got it." thats fair but i also dont believe in magic This...is what I was talking about... You don't get it, no one says you must...it's not the 1500's anymore, you won't be burned at the stake for blasphemy, but I'm a firm believer that respect should be given to those of all faiths. |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 8:51:50 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead
i'll be a believer
thats all
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Post by Just Another Shem on May 30, 2014 8:57:45 GMT -5
thats fair but i also dont believe in magic This...is what I was talking about... You don't get it, no one says you must...it's not the 1500's anymore, you won't be burned at the stake for blasphemy, but I'm a firm believer that respect should be given to those of all faiths. the ironic thing for me is that I definitely do believe in God. But most of the religious arguments I get into our with the believers as well. And it's always with the folks who don't feel the need to incessantly stuff their religion into our faces. I'm not necessarily referring to anybody here. But in general there's a segment of people who feel the need to talk about how they live their life according to God and how it makes them just such a better person than the rest of us. Its really pretentious and it really annoys me. |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 8:57:57 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Don't think Huw was asking you to be a believer...just for a smidgen more respect of his faith... |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 8:58:51 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Trillions and trillions of atoms suddenly appearing in a vast vaccum with no explaination of where they came from? That sounds like magic to me. When science can explain the origin of existence/metter, I'll be a non-believer. But, that isn't going to happen in my lifetime. |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 9:00:07 GMT -5
This...is what I was talking about... You don't get it, no one says you must...it's not the 1500's anymore, you won't be burned at the stake for blasphemy, but I'm a firm believer that respect should be given to those of all faiths. the ironic thing for me is that I definitely do believe in God. But most of the religious arguments I get into our with the believers as well. And it's always with the folks who don't feel the need to incessantly stuff their religion into our faces. I'm not necessarily referring to anybody here. But in general there's a segment of people who feel the need to talk about how they live their life according to God and how it makes them just such a better person than the rest of us. Its really pretentious and it really annoys me. Rock is the opposite side of that same coin...atheists have become as pretentious...and infinitely more condescending...taking the tact of intellectual superiority to boot... |
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Post by Just Another Shem on May 30, 2014 9:00:19 GMT -5
I feel the same way about politics. I completely respect every person's right to their opinion. But I only end up arguing with the one to feel the need to stuff their opinion in my face and call me a moron if I don't believe everything that they believe. Down and dick shot are both very guilty of this behavior over here.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 9:00:32 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Don't think Huw was asking you to be a believer...just for a smidgen more respect of his faith... i know, but its really hard for me to respect a magician and a book of fish stories outside of this place, im respectful of the religious rights of others believe it or not, im not vocal about my feelings unless asked and even them im tame with it. |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 9:01:32 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Trillions and trillions of atoms suddenly appearing in a vast vaccum with no explaination of where they came from? That sounds like magic to me. When science can explain the origin of existence/metter, I'll be a non-believer. But, that isn't going to happen in my lifetime. "every painting was created by an artist" An argument a religious friend of mine once made... 10 years later, I still have no solid retort... |
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Post by Royale McRoyals on May 30, 2014 9:02:12 GMT -5
Fair point: MANY churches more closely resemble a social club than a community of faith. Can't deny all the evil that has been done in the world in the name of god/religion. Period. Shouldn't toss out all the good that's been done in the same name. huw since you are at least somewhat religious, can I ask you a question? Have you ever brought in any sheaves and what the hell are they if you have? used to watch Little House on the Prairie with my folks as a kid and every time there was a church scene they were always singing "Bringing in the Sheaves" Sheaves are bundles of harvested wheat. It's a metaphor for gathering the people that belong to God. Jesus made many references to working for god's kingdom as being like working on a farm, since that was the nearly height of technological advancement at the time. He famously stated that "the harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few," which can roughly be translated into: "if you're not one of God's appointed laborers, you don't get it." He also compared god to a shepherd and people to sheep, stating that "the sheep know their shepherd's voice," which can similarly be translated to, "if you don't recognize God's voice, you don't get it." |
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Post by b1ake on May 30, 2014 9:02:25 GMT -5
the ironic thing for me is that I definitely do believe in God. But most of the religious arguments I get into our with the believers as well. And it's always with the folks who don't feel the need to incessantly stuff their religion into our faces. I'm not necessarily referring to anybody here. But in general there's a segment of people who feel the need to talk about how they live their life according to God and how it makes them just such a better person than the rest of us. Its really pretentious and it really annoys me. .atheists have become as pretentious...and infinitely more condescending...taking the tact of intellectual superiority to boot... This. Disclaimer: I'm not religious |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 9:03:19 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Trillions and trillions of atoms suddenly appearing in a vast vaccum with no explaination of where they came from? That sounds like magic to me. When science can explain the origin of existence/metter, I'll be a non-believer. But, that isn't going to happen in my lifetime. string theory thats all |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 9:04:21 GMT -5
I feel the same way about politics. I completely respect every person's right to their opinion. But I only end up arguing with the one to feel the need to stuff their opinion in my face and call me a moron if I don't believe everything that they believe. Down and dick shot are both very guilty of this behavior over here. Sorry, liberalism is truly a mental disease...and I get really frustrated by those with such a weak grasp of basic economics.... up is never down wet is never dry and more federal government spending is never a good thing 3 absolute truths... |
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Post by redsoxworrld on May 30, 2014 9:04:31 GMT -5
huw since you are at least somewhat religious, can I ask you a question? Have you ever brought in any sheaves and what the hell are they if you have? used to watch Little House on the Prairie with my folks as a kid and every time there was a church scene they were always singing "Bringing in the Sheaves" Sheaves are bundles of harvested wheat. It's a metaphor for gathering the people that belong to God. Jesus made many references to working for god's kingdom as being like working on a farm, since that was the nearly height of technological advancement at the time. He famously stated that "the harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few," which can roughly be translated into: "if you're not one of God's appointed laborers, you don't get it." He also compared god to a shepherd and people to sheep, stating that "the sheep know their shepherd's voice," which can similarly be translated to, "if you don't recognize God's voice, you don't get it." wow Jesus went around saying "You don't get it, you're not from around here" fucking rock, man!! he's related to everything and everybody |
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Post by Mr mastodon farm on May 30, 2014 9:04:55 GMT -5
This...is what I was talking about... You don't get it, no one says you must...it's not the 1500's anymore, you won't be burned at the stake for blasphemy, but I'm a firm believer that respect should be given to those of all faiths. the ironic thing for me is that I definitely do believe in God. But most of the religious arguments I get into our with the believers as well. And it's always with the folks who don't feel the need to incessantly stuff their religion into our faces. I'm not necessarily referring to anybody here. But in general there's a segment of people who feel the need to talk about how they live their life according to God and how it makes them just such a better person than the rest of us. Its really pretentious and it really annoys me. I agree with that. |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 9:09:54 GMT -5
the ironic thing for me is that I definitely do believe in God. But most of the religious arguments I get into our with the believers as well. And it's always with the folks who don't feel the need to incessantly stuff their religion into our faces. I'm not necessarily referring to anybody here. But in general there's a segment of people who feel the need to talk about how they live their life according to God and how it makes them just such a better person than the rest of us. Its really pretentious and it really annoys me. I agree with that. Word. Every church has a few people like the ones snoogs is referring too. Every message board does too, except this one. We don't have any holier than thou types shoving their religion in your face. Geneh is a bit like that but he manages to keep a lid on it most of the time. But we do have an atheist who does it. |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 9:11:46 GMT -5
Trillions and trillions of atoms suddenly appearing in a vast vaccum with no explaination of where they came from? That sounds like magic to me. When science can explain the origin of existence/metter, I'll be a non-believer. But, that isn't going to happen in my lifetime. string theory thats all You understand the meaning of that bolded word, correct? Went to a musical and cosmological event last friday night with the wife at a local planetarium, spoke with 2 astrophysicists...one looked just like Steve Zaun, swear to god... They don't know...they have math that might explain some things, like string theory, but it's all theoretical... To "believe" in "theory" you must have "faith"....you placing yours in something else? Makes you no fundamentally different. Huw places faith in his scripture and cleregy, you place yours in mathematics and physicists...neither group has all the answers yet...and require a degree of faith to subscribe to their explanations... |
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Post by Royale McRoyals on May 30, 2014 9:11:58 GMT -5
when i see a cat turn water into wine, part an ocean, and rise from the dead i'll be a believer thats all Plenty of people actually watched him do all these cool things and still didn't believe, but rather plotted his death. Plenty of people never saw the miracles and yet they DID believe. One of his own best friends didn't believe he was alive until he laid hands and eyes on him. Jesus told him, "Happy are you because you have SEEN and believed, happy will be those who have not seen, but believe." I'm doing rough paraphrasings here. |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 9:13:29 GMT -5
Trillions and trillions of atoms suddenly appearing in a vast vaccum with no explaination of where they came from? That sounds like magic to me. When science can explain the origin of existence/metter, I'll be a non-believer. But, that isn't going to happen in my lifetime. string theory thats all Might be at least a plausible theory if it did not employ gravity. But it does, and there is no logical explanation for gravity. |
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Post by Just Another Shem on May 30, 2014 9:13:33 GMT -5
I feel the same way about politics. I completely respect every person's right to their opinion. But I only end up arguing with the one to feel the need to stuff their opinion in my face and call me a moron if I don't believe everything that they believe. Down and dick shot are both very guilty of this behavior over here. Sorry, liberalism is truly a mental disease...and I get really frustrated by those with such a weak grasp of basic economics.... up is never down wet is never dry and more federal government spending is never a good thing 3 absolute truths... yes because it was Liberal government that started an unfunded war with a country that did not attack us on 911. |
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2014 9:16:04 GMT -5
You understand the meaning of that bolded word, correct? Went to a musical and cosmological event last friday night with the wife at a local planetarium, spoke with 2 astrophysicists...one looked just like Steve Zaun, swear to god... They don't know...they have math that might explain some things, like string theory, but it's all theoretical... To "believe" in "theory" you must have "faith"....you placing yours in something else? Makes you no fundamentally different. Huw places faith in his scripture and cleregy, you place yours in mathematics and physicists...neither group has all the answers yet...and require a degree of faith to subscribe to their explanations... im smart i know what a theory is to believe a theory i have to have some semblance of faith is where said theory is derived. its derived from...science...which, over the course of history, has explained away many of the building blocks of many faiths..and explained the once unexplainable, which is one of the basis for faith/religion. science has traditionally been the "put up or shut up"...ask a question, get an answer whereas religion has always been "this is what it is because its always been this way" |
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Post by down38str8 on May 30, 2014 9:16:16 GMT -5
Sorry, liberalism is truly a mental disease...and I get really frustrated by those with such a weak grasp of basic economics.... up is never down wet is never dry and more federal government spending is never a good thing 3 absolute truths... yes because it was Liberal government that started an unfunded war with a country that did not attack us on 911. Actually it was...Iraq, and I've been on record a hundred times saying this, was not a "conservative" move...it was made by a self described neo-conservative... Neo-conservatism is just liberalism designed to appeal to the bible belt voters... George Bush was horrible...but it's been 6 years, you can stop blaming him now... |
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