Mr mastodon farm
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Post by Mr mastodon farm on Jan 8, 2015 18:34:32 GMT -5
tuck rule
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Post by Zig on Jan 8, 2015 18:41:47 GMT -5
Nope. Not according to the official poll The people have spoken. So it shall be
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Post by boxedlunch on Jan 8, 2015 21:00:33 GMT -5
I'm not sure that "bad call" really fits this. VERY badly executed, for sure. Looking at the play, you can see where it might not get called. It looks like PI, but you can see where it might not get call. The problem is, it did get called. That's when the crew really messed this one. First of all, the white hat should not have announced the penalty before all was worked out. That's obvious, but I find it hard to blame him if he saw the play. The defender did not turn back and ran right though the receiver. Seeing the flag thrown, he probably thought what everybody else did, that it must have been pretty obvious. When the defender does not turn back and runs through the receiver, it's called almost every time. What I find curious is what happened between the official who threw the flag and the other official who had the "better view". There are some calls where having the better view is what you go with, such as if a receiver is in-bounds when he catches it. Two official might have seen it different, but you trust who had the better view. Other penalties are called if any official sees it. Illegal motion for instance, will be called if one official sees it, even if an official with a "better view" might not have seen it. Holding is another. You don't see official consulting on holding to see if they agree on it. If one official saw a penalty, they call it. It's similar with Pass Interference, which is why it's surreal that it got changed. Having a "better view" might not mean you saw the play accurately. The official who saw the penalty should have stuck by it because, as replays show, he saw it correctly. After announcing the flag was picked up, the official was recorded explaining it to Stafford, saying that it was face guarding. Obviously, that was incorrect because there was contact and it was not face guarding, so again you have the officials sticking by something that was incorrect. This is the bizarre aspect of it. If the flag never flies or if they never pick it up you have little to no controversy over it. Instead they did it right up until the play stops and then they blow it. It's easy to see how an official can make a mistake at full speed. It's hard for me to forgive the error when they have time to deal with it, then do everything wrong. Which is what makes this really strange because it looks awful. The did it right until they have the sideline screaming at them and a player runs on the field to argue, the crowd is booing them. I've heard it said they were intimidated and it's hard to argue they weren't. This is what makes this a huge gaffe on the official's part. Missing the call is understandable, not being up for the moment is another matter all-together. I never understand the whole "refs were intimidated" angle - not with American sports. At worst they'll get booed, maybe hear some crude chants from the crowd, and probably get nasty comments on social media. But they should be used to that. These guys aren't in any physical danger. The fans aren't going to riot. And this isn't Brazilian soccer where referees get murdered after a game over a yellow card. Otherwise I agree with you - the penalty was subjective but once they announce it they have to stick with it. I don't know if they were intimidated or not, but it smacked of it. Having officiated football and basketball, I understand that refs can get intimidated. A lot of people do when people are yelling at them.
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Otis B. Driftwood
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I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it.
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Jan 9, 2015 9:35:27 GMT -5
I never understand the whole "refs were intimidated" angle - not with American sports. At worst they'll get booed, maybe hear some crude chants from the crowd, and probably get nasty comments on social media. But they should be used to that. These guys aren't in any physical danger. The fans aren't going to riot. And this isn't Brazilian soccer where referees get murdered after a game over a yellow card. Otherwise I agree with you - the penalty was subjective but once they announce it they have to stick with it. I don't know if they were intimidated or not, but it smacked of it. Having officiated football and basketball, I understand that refs can get intimidated. A lot of people do when people are yelling at them. A former classmate referees Texas HS football. Some of the stories he tells are scary. Then again - you sit around enough redneck moms and grandmothers yelling at referees and you can understand where he's coming from.
I speak from personal experience.
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Post by boxedlunch on Jan 9, 2015 20:35:56 GMT -5
I don't know if they were intimidated or not, but it smacked of it. Having officiated football and basketball, I understand that refs can get intimidated. A lot of people do when people are yelling at them. A former classmate referees Texas HS football. Some of the stories he tells are scary. Then again - you sit around enough redneck moms and grandmothers yelling at referees and you can understand where he's coming from.
I speak from personal experience.
My father was a high school official and basketball and football. I used to go to games with him and sit in the crowd. People get emotional. I regret never thinking to say "nice call, dad" after somebody called him names. One time when I was waiting for him afterwards, a basketball coach had to be restrained from going in and beating up the officials. A fairly big name coach in the area, also known for his hot head and generally a nice enough guy, but people are emotional about this stuff and are not rational. You can't tell me that there are official out there completely immune to people emotionally screaming their heads off at them. Frankly, this is the nicest interpretation on what happened here that I can come up with.
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Post by Zig on Jan 9, 2015 20:48:18 GMT -5
The real problem in the Det/Dallas game was a team of officials not used to working together. If that was a reg season crew I doubt they defer to another official much further away like they did on the picked up flag. It was right in front of the official that threw the flag but another official who was supposed to be watching something else mind you, had a better look at it?
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Mr mastodon farm
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Post by Mr mastodon farm on Jan 10, 2015 10:40:10 GMT -5
Nope. Not according to the official poll The people have spoken. So it shall be the most recent controversy is always the worst ever once it dies down, everybody will remember it was the tuck rule
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2015 11:04:50 GMT -5
My worst call of all time is a toss up. Not marrying my first wife or my second. Or not going to college when I was a kid.
Oh, you guys are talking about football, sorry.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 11, 2015 22:42:31 GMT -5
I never understand the whole "refs were intimidated" angle - not with American sports. At worst they'll get booed, maybe hear some crude chants from the crowd, and probably get nasty comments on social media. But they should be used to that. These guys aren't in any physical danger. The fans aren't going to riot. And this isn't Brazilian soccer where referees get murdered after a game over a yellow card. Otherwise I agree with you - the penalty was subjective but once they announce it they have to stick with it. I don't know if they were intimidated or not, but it smacked of it. Having officiated football and basketball, I understand that refs can get intimidated. A lot of people do when people are yelling at them. And some go the other way and purposely antagonize the crowd cause they have Napoleon syndrome
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2015 9:23:22 GMT -5
This thread title causes me pain. It brought the pain.
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Post by boxedlunch on Jan 12, 2015 11:53:04 GMT -5
I don't know if they were intimidated or not, but it smacked of it. Having officiated football and basketball, I understand that refs can get intimidated. A lot of people do when people are yelling at them. And some go the other way and purposely antagonize the crowd cause they have Napoleon syndrome This is true.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 13, 2015 16:04:50 GMT -5
Great point by Elliot Harrison at NFL.com To me, the real problem was not this ambiguous rule of securing the ball and "making a football move" -- it was the failure to follow the purported rules of instant replay. If we aren't totally sure whether Bryant was lunging for the end zone or merely stumbling to secure a catch -- i.e., whether or not he was making a football move -- then we don't have the incontrovertible evidence that is required to overturn the ruling on the field, right? Thus, the call on the field should've stood.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 13, 2015 16:05:56 GMT -5
Don Banks from SI.com Nobody ever said it better than Madden, if 3 guys sitting in bar all know it's a catch, it is. Bad rule. Right call doesn't change that.
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Post by The Bag on Jan 13, 2015 16:17:32 GMT -5
wasnt there a fake field goal WAY back by the giants in sf, where they heaved the ball into the end zone, the receiver was raped, and they didnt call it??
i could be wrong. but i remember something on that play was TOTALLY missed and ended the game. someone here may remember.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 13, 2015 16:38:06 GMT -5
wasnt there a fake field goal WAY back by the giants in sf, where they heaved the ball into the end zone, the receiver was raped, and they didnt call it?? i could be wrong. but i remember something on that play was TOTALLY missed and ended the game. someone here may remember. Almost every Hail Mary should have flags flying for Holding and Interference
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Post by The Bag on Jan 13, 2015 16:45:26 GMT -5
wasnt there a fake field goal WAY back by the giants in sf, where they heaved the ball into the end zone, the receiver was raped, and they didnt call it?? i could be wrong. but i remember something on that play was TOTALLY missed and ended the game. someone here may remember. Almost every Hail Mary should have flags flying for Holding and Interference true, but if you know the game/play im talking to, it was bad. i believe the 49ers won, and it was a low scoring game. i wanna say parcells was the coach still for the giants. im reaching here, but i wanna say a lineman was backpeddling waiting for the ball to come down and someone just mauled him. if he caught it he walks in the end zone for the win. someone here HAD to see it.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 13, 2015 16:51:35 GMT -5
2002 Giants holder Matt Allen threw into end zone to Seubert and the league later said PI should have been called on the play
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Post by The Bag on Jan 13, 2015 17:51:58 GMT -5
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 13, 2015 18:01:11 GMT -5
I coulda swore he was in the end zone but after looking at this, spot the ball at the 3 and a half yard line 1 st and Goal Giants
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Post by The Bag on Jan 13, 2015 18:26:16 GMT -5
I coulda swore he was in the end zone but after looking at this, spot the ball at the 3 and a half yard line 1 st and Goal Giants i thought he was in the end zone too. maybe it was a 4th down and they still had time on the clock? and from what i member, this picture doesnt do the PI any justice at all. like he started pulling him down when the ball was NOWHERE near the giant yet.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 15, 2015 19:24:43 GMT -5
I like the shit out of that comment but can only click the button so many times... Receivers get straight up mugged on Hair Mary passes - shoved in the back, thrown to the ground, et cetera - no ref ever calls it. But they should. And being that the play can't end on a defensive penalty, a lot of games should end differently. With that said, it would likely piss me off more if they did call those. Simply because I hate that they would spot the ball at the 1 yard line. IMO pass interference should be held to the "half the distance to the end zone" limit, just like every other damn penalty. And while I'm completely digressing from the topic at hand to vent about rules... What's with the "automatic first down" defensive penalties? It could be 3rd-and-28, the defense gets called for holding - a five yard penalty - why the fuck does the offense get an automatic first down? That's bullshit. IMO that should result in a 3rd-and-23. I remember the olden days when teams would be 1st and 5 after a defensive offside
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2015 22:45:14 GMT -5
I like the shit out of that comment but can only click the button so many times... Receivers get straight up mugged on Hair Mary passes - shoved in the back, thrown to the ground, et cetera - no ref ever calls it. But they should. And being that the play can't end on a defensive penalty, a lot of games should end differently. With that said, it would likely piss me off more if they did call those. Simply because I hate that they would spot the ball at the 1 yard line. IMO pass interference should be held to the "half the distance to the end zone" limit, just like every other damn penalty. And while I'm completely digressing from the topic at hand to vent about rules... What's with the "automatic first down" defensive penalties? It could be 3rd-and-28, the defense gets called for holding - a five yard penalty - why the fuck does the offense get an automatic first down? That's bullshit. IMO that should result in a 3rd-and-23. Intentional Grounding....where is the punishment? It is just like a sack....spot foul and loss of down. It should be an additional 15 yds from where he threw the ball plus loss of down.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2015 22:49:02 GMT -5
Nope. Not according to the official poll The people have spoken. So it shall be Just means the people voted wrong again....
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Post by williewilliejuan on Jan 15, 2015 23:12:11 GMT -5
The poll is flawed. The worst call of all time was Franco Harris's "catch" of the Immaculate Reception.
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Post by Leader O'Cola on Jan 16, 2015 14:06:34 GMT -5
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Post by Leader O'Cola on Jan 16, 2015 14:12:55 GMT -5
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 16, 2015 14:18:41 GMT -5
Is your brother Chachi here? Does Joanie still love Chachi ?!?
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 16, 2015 14:25:49 GMT -5
The Steelers still won so sorry this is not a WORST CALL Nomimee
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2015 14:39:35 GMT -5
I like the shit out of that comment but can only click the button so many times... Receivers get straight up mugged on Hair Mary passes - shoved in the back, thrown to the ground, et cetera - no ref ever calls it. But they should. And being that the play can't end on a defensive penalty, a lot of games should end differently. With that said, it would likely piss me off more if they did call those. Simply because I hate that they would spot the ball at the 1 yard line. IMO pass interference should be held to the "half the distance to the end zone" limit, just like every other damn penalty. And while I'm completely digressing from the topic at hand to vent about rules... What's with the "automatic first down" defensive penalties? It could be 3rd-and-28, the defense gets called for holding - a five yard penalty - why the fuck does the offense get an automatic first down? That's bullshit. IMO that should result in a 3rd-and-23. Seriously. 10 yards. Replay down. Just like the offense
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Jan 18, 2015 1:21:51 GMT -5
The poll is flawed. The worst call of all time was Franco Harris's "catch" of the Immaculate Reception. That rule wasn't changed till 5 years after. Kinda like what's going to finally happen about the Megatron catch of 2010
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