tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Sept 18, 2014 21:21:02 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate.
First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues.
You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there!
I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys.
So here goes...
AMERICAN LEAGUE
Yankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio
Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer
Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams
Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price
Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter
Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline
Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr.
White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio
Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew
Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen
Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan
Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson
Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez
Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young
Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio
NATIONAL LEAGUE
Nationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines
Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux
Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw
Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton
Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle Willis
Cardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson
Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell
Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil Cooper
Reds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez
Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams
Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke Snider
Giants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey
Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez
Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones
Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton
Debate?
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Sept 18, 2014 22:21:10 GMT -5
Honorable Mentions.
AMERICAN LEAGUE
Yankees - Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera
Orioles - Frank Robinson, Cal Ripken
Red Sox - Carl Yastrzemski, Pedro Martinez
Rays - Fred McGriff
Blue Jays - Dave Stieb, Roy Halladay
Tigers - Miguel Cabrera, Mickey Lolich
Indians - Luis Tiant, Larry Doby
White Sox - Wilbur Wood, Dick Allen
Twins - Joe Mauer, Tony Oliva
Royals - Willie Wilson, John Mayberry
Angels - Dean Chance, Frank Tanana
Athletics - Jim "Catfish" Hunter, Rollie Fingers
Mariners - Randy Johnson, Ichiro Suzuki
Rangers - Juan Gonzalez, Adrian Beltre
Astros - Jim Wynn, Larry Dierker
National League
Nationals - Pedro Martinez (Expos), Jordan Zimmermann
Braves - Eddie Mathews, Tom Glavine
Mets - Keith Hernandez, Darryl Strawberry
Phillies - Richie Ashburn, Roy Halladay
Marlins - Josh Beckett
Cardinals - Joe Torre, Ozzie Smith
Pirates - Ralph Kiner, Dave Parker
Reds - Ted Kluszewski, Frank Robinson
Brewers - Rollie Fingers, Pete Vuckovitz
Cubs - Kerry Wood, Ron Santo
Dodgers - Jackie Robinson, Clayton Kershaw
Giants - Juan Marichal, Gaylord Perry
Diamondbacks - Randy Johnson, Paul Goldschmidt
Padres - Dave Dravecky, Eric Show
Rockies - Troy Tulowitzki, Andres Gallaraga
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bigddude
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Post by bigddude on Sept 19, 2014 13:51:11 GMT -5
Interesting. VERY interesting. As I would expect from you, there are no glaring odd choices, only choices that could be debated, and, would be worthy of same.
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Post by Zig on Sept 20, 2014 15:54:14 GMT -5
Good stuff. I know Joe Morgan played on a few teams but I'd have him at least as an honorable mention for the Reds. Maybe because I'm a a Red Sox fan, that's how I think of him, as a Red
and a jerk! lol
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2014 16:48:22 GMT -5
Too many great Yanks and Sox to get them all. I liked Dwight Evans and Fred Lynn a lot, though.
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Post by BHR on Sept 20, 2014 18:22:05 GMT -5
I know how good Maddux was..but my heart really wants Smoltzie in there or Dale Murphy.
Sadly to me, Maddux is and always will be a Cubbie
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Post by calsnowskier on Feb 13, 2015 20:51:37 GMT -5
Not a horrible list. As BigD said, only some that are worthy of debate...
1) Giants
Mays is the top, no question. And McCovey deserve HM AT WORST. But I think the recent success of the team over the last 25 years, and more specifically over the last 5 years, means that the Mt Rushmore needs to go through a face lift. I don't think Perry even comes close to making that cut over guys like Bonds, Clark, or Posey. I would actually argue that Posey should hold the #2 slot, above McCovey.
But that is only if we are limiting this discussion to players. If it is open to anyone, I would say Bochy gets the #2 slot.
My Mt Rushmore would be Mays, Bochy as the top with McCovey and Posey as the HM. It is REALLY hard to leave guys like Bonds, Marichal, Clark, Lincecum and Bum off the list, but this is a SOLID group that can only hold 4 names.
2) Padres
I am not a Padres fan, but I do live in San Diego. I like your top 2. I am not sure there is much argument there. MAYBE replace Jones with Coleman. He was REALY loved and respected in this city. His military background really played well in this military city.
I don't agree with either of your HM, though. Caminiti was loved by fans of the Padres, drugs or not. I think he needs to make the HM.
Gwynn/Coleman and Jones/Cameniti, I think are the appropriate guys here. Peavy, Gonzalez and Winfield are HM to HM, I think.
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Post by Zig on Feb 13, 2015 21:15:04 GMT -5
Not a horrible list. As BigD said, only some that are worthy of debate... 1) Giants Mays is the top, no question. And McCovey deserve HM AT WORST. But I think the recent success of the team over the last 25 years, and more specifically over the last 5 years, means that the Mt Rushmore needs to go through a face lift. I don't think Perry even comes close to making that cut over guys like Bonds, Clark, or Posey. I would actually argue that Posey should hold the #2 slot, above McCovey. But that is only if we are limiting this discussion to players. If it is open to anyone, I would say Bochy gets the #2 slot. My Mt Rushmore would be Mays, Bochy as the top with McCovey and Posey as the HM. It is REALLY hard to leave guys like Bonds, Marichal, Clark, Lincecum and Bum off the list, but this is a SOLID group that can only hold 4 names. 2) Padres I am not a Padres fan, but I do live in San Diego. I like your top 2. I am not sure there is much argument there. MAYBE replace Jones with Coleman. He was REALY loved and respected in this city. His military background really played well in this military city. I don't agree with either of your HM, though. Caminiti was loved by fans of the Padres, drugs or not. I think he needs to make the HM. Gwynn/Coleman and Jones/Cameniti, I think are the appropriate guys here. Peavy, Gonzalez and Winfield are HM to HM, I think. You were a Pads fan a few minutes ago! |
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Post by calsnowskier on Feb 13, 2015 21:17:45 GMT -5
Not a horrible list. As BigD said, only some that are worthy of debate... 1) Giants Mays is the top, no question. And McCovey deserve HM AT WORST. But I think the recent success of the team over the last 25 years, and more specifically over the last 5 years, means that the Mt Rushmore needs to go through a face lift. I don't think Perry even comes close to making that cut over guys like Bonds, Clark, or Posey. I would actually argue that Posey should hold the #2 slot, above McCovey. But that is only if we are limiting this discussion to players. If it is open to anyone, I would say Bochy gets the #2 slot. My Mt Rushmore would be Mays, Bochy as the top with McCovey and Posey as the HM. It is REALLY hard to leave guys like Bonds, Marichal, Clark, Lincecum and Bum off the list, but this is a SOLID group that can only hold 4 names. 2) Padres I am not a Padres fan, but I do live in San Diego. I like your top 2. I am not sure there is much argument there. MAYBE replace Jones with Coleman. He was REALY loved and respected in this city. His military background really played well in this military city. I don't agree with either of your HM, though. Caminiti was loved by fans of the Padres, drugs or not. I think he needs to make the HM. Gwynn/Coleman and Jones/Cameniti, I think are the appropriate guys here. Peavy, Gonzalez and Winfield are HM to HM, I think. You were a Pads fan a few minutes ago! What can I say. I am fickle. |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 13, 2015 21:50:26 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate. First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues. You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there! I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys. So here goes... AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr. White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio NATIONAL LEAGUENationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle WillisCardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil CooperReds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke SniderGiants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton Debate? I don't know about debate but I would have Ted and Yaz ahead of Papa. Can't see Trout over Ryan he will probably be one day but 3 seasons is a little early. The most glaring omission has to be Jackie Robinson as HM instead of 1 or 2 and Gary Carter is Mr Expo. I'd take Molitor over Cooper for sure and if Trout is in the discussion for the Angels Stanton should be one for the Marlins, williewilliejuan will be happy all his names are included as Giants |
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Post by calsnowskier on Feb 13, 2015 22:01:29 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate. First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues. You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there! I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys. So here goes... AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr. White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio NATIONAL LEAGUENationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle WillisCardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil CooperReds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke SniderGiants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton Debate? I don't know about debate but I would have Ted and Yaz ahead of Papa. Can't see Trout over Ryan he will probably be one day but 3 seasons is a little early. The most glaring omission has to be Jackie Robinson as HM instead of 1 or 2 and Gary Carter is Mr Expo. I'd take Molitor over Cooper for sure and if Trout is in the discussion for the Angels Stanton should be one for the Marlins, williewilliejuan will be happy all his names are included as Giants I think Papi deserves the #1 spot. He has 3 rings with the cursed team. That is pretty massive.
Agree about 42. Quite possibly the most iconic player in all of sports. How can he not be top 2 for the dogs?
Carter is a tough call. Dawson and Raines are pretty synonymous with the Expos, but so is Carter. Not sure Zim has earned the designation yet and I am not sure Martinez deserves the designation with the Expos.
Agree about the Marlins. Stanton needs to be #1.
I forgot one name for the Padres... Hoffman. He MIGHT replace Cam as HM, but I am not sure...
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Feb 13, 2015 22:18:30 GMT -5
I would probably substitute Jim Sundberg for Juan Gonzales on the Rangers Honorable Mention. For years he was about the only icon the Rangers had. All class and steady as a rock. And he is still an icon down here. For all of Juan-doe's offensive feats, he was average defensively and the stain of PED's is all over him.
Other than that - I have no argument with your choices.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 14, 2015 0:04:32 GMT -5
I don't know about debate but I would have Ted and Yaz ahead of Papa. Can't see Trout over Ryan he will probably be one day but 3 seasons is a little early. The most glaring omission has to be Jackie Robinson as HM instead of 1 or 2 and Gary Carter is Mr Expo. I'd take Molitor over Cooper for sure and if Trout is in the discussion for the Angels Stanton should be one for the Marlins, williewilliejuan will be happy all his names are included as Giants I think Papi deserves the #1 spot. He has 3 rings with the cursed team. That is pretty massive.
Agree about 42. Quite possibly the most iconic player in all of sports. How can he not be top 2 for the dogs?
Carter is a tough call. Dawson and Raines are pretty synonymous with the Expos, but so is Carter. Not sure Zim has earned the designation yet and I am not sure Martinez deserves the designation with the Expos.
Agree about the Marlins. Stanton needs to be #1.
I forgot one name for the Padres... Hoffman. He MIGHT replace Cam as HM, but I am not sure...
I'd take Vladimir over Zim and Dawson asked to have a Cubs cap for his HoF plaque so fuck him See the point on Papi but I'll take 2 triple crowners over a DH any day |
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Post by calsnowskier on Feb 14, 2015 1:07:59 GMT -5
I think Papi deserves the #1 spot. He has 3 rings with the cursed team. That is pretty massive.
Agree about 42. Quite possibly the most iconic player in all of sports. How can he not be top 2 for the dogs?
Carter is a tough call. Dawson and Raines are pretty synonymous with the Expos, but so is Carter. Not sure Zim has earned the designation yet and I am not sure Martinez deserves the designation with the Expos.
Agree about the Marlins. Stanton needs to be #1.
I forgot one name for the Padres... Hoffman. He MIGHT replace Cam as HM, but I am not sure...
I'd take Vladimir over Zim and Dawson asked to have a Cubs cap for his HoF plaque so fuck him See the point on Papi but I'll take 2 triple crowners over a DH any day If we are talking HOF, no way Papi gets in. But he is the heart and soul of the team that broke the curse. i am no Bostonian, but I gotta believe that Papi hold a place in Boston Sports lore that nobody, not even Teddy Ballgame, can match. but you did hit a nice triple with the DH comment. I almost tapped out.  |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 14, 2015 1:47:37 GMT -5
I'd take Vladimir over Zim and Dawson asked to have a Cubs cap for his HoF plaque so fuck him See the point on Papi but I'll take 2 triple crowners over a DH any day If we are talking HOF, no way Papi gets in. But he is the heart and soul of the team that broke the curse. i am no Bostonian, but I gotta believe that Papi hold a place in Boston Sports lore that nobody, not even Teddy Ballgame, can match. but you did hit a nice triple with the DH comment. I almost tapped out. Standing up at that |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 4:25:27 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate. First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues. You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there! I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys. So here goes... AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr. White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio NATIONAL LEAGUENationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle WillisCardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil CooperReds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke SniderGiants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton Debate? I don't know about debate but I would have Ted and Yaz ahead of Papa. Can't see Trout over Ryan he will probably be one day but 3 seasons is a little early. The most glaring omission has to be Jackie Robinson as HM instead of 1 or 2 and Gary Carter is Mr Expo. I'd take Molitor over Cooper for sure and if Trout is in the discussion for the Angels Stanton should be one for the Marlins, williewilliejuan will be happy all his names are included as Giants I agree with all of it...Robinson replaces the "Duke", Carter replaces cokehead Raines, Molitor replaces Cooper. Stanton is too much of a work in progress, i.m.o. |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 4:29:25 GMT -5
I don't know about debate but I would have Ted and Yaz ahead of Papa. Can't see Trout over Ryan he will probably be one day but 3 seasons is a little early. The most glaring omission has to be Jackie Robinson as HM instead of 1 or 2 and Gary Carter is Mr Expo. I'd take Molitor over Cooper for sure and if Trout is in the discussion for the Angels Stanton should be one for the Marlins, williewilliejuan will be happy all his names are included as Giants I think Papi deserves the #1 spot. He has 3 rings with the cursed team. That is pretty massive.
Agree about 42. Quite possibly the most iconic player in all of sports. How can he not be top 2 for the dogs?
Carter is a tough call. Dawson and Raines are pretty synonymous with the Expos, but so is Carter. Not sure Zim has earned the designation yet and I am not sure Martinez deserves the designation with the Expos.
Agree about the Marlins. Stanton needs to be #1.
I forgot one name for the Padres... Hoffman. He MIGHT replace Cam as HM, but I am not sure...
Hoffman should probably replace Randy Jones. No Caminiti. Stanton would make it but unlike the Rockies, the Marlins won World Series with the guys I list and Stanton will overtake somebody at any time there, but not yet, i.m.o. |
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 4:35:18 GMT -5
I think Papi deserves the #1 spot. He has 3 rings with the cursed team. That is pretty massive.
Agree about 42. Quite possibly the most iconic player in all of sports. How can he not be top 2 for the dogs?
Carter is a tough call. Dawson and Raines are pretty synonymous with the Expos, but so is Carter. Not sure Zim has earned the designation yet and I am not sure Martinez deserves the designation with the Expos.
Agree about the Marlins. Stanton needs to be #1.
I forgot one name for the Padres... Hoffman. He MIGHT replace Cam as HM, but I am not sure...
I'd take Vladimir over Zim and Dawson asked to have a Cubs cap for his HoF plaque so fuck him See the point on Papi but I'll take 2 triple crowners over a DH any day Any DH except Papi. No DH ever made the impact that Ortiz makes in Boston. Nooo-body. No Papi = No titles since 1918. |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 14, 2015 5:06:48 GMT -5
I'd take Vladimir over Zim and Dawson asked to have a Cubs cap for his HoF plaque so fuck him See the point on Papi but I'll take 2 triple crowners over a DH any day Any DH except Papi. No DH ever made the impact that Ortiz makes in Boston. Nooo-body. No Papi = No titles since 1918. I'm still pissed that Edgar ain't getting any love from the HoF |
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 8:38:48 GMT -5
Any DH except Papi. No DH ever made the impact that Ortiz makes in Boston. Nooo-body. No Papi = No titles since 1918. I'm still pissed that Edgar ain't getting any love from the HoF Edgar Martinez should be in the HoF i.m.o. I believe that David Ortiz should as well. Apparently a lot of "purists" in the game have a problem with designated hitters. Edgar is the forerunner to one of my own all time favorites, another Martinez. This one named Victor. He probably won't get any love either because if Edgar is not getting any love, Victor won't because i.m.o. Edgar is the better of the two. Victor reminds me so much of Edgar though. When the Tigers signed Victor to his four year deal this off season and numerous people bitched, I pointed to Edgar because at age 37, Edgar put up this 3/4/5 line (.324/.423/.579) with 145 RBI. Even Victor will not touch this, although the hitting / pitching balance has admittedly tipped way in favor of the pitcher since 2000. |
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 14, 2015 8:46:43 GMT -5
Good post. Kershaw does not deserve to be on the honorary list. It is easy to let the soup deJour get too much love. Not yet, not with that franchise and it's history. Maybe someday, maybe not.
Guys like Maury Wills are way ahead of him at this point. Gil Hodges, guys from those late 70s and 80s teams and the Drysdale era.
To date Kershaw is a recent regualar season wonder. He may end up the greatest of all time, but not on a list that goes back to 1946.
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 14, 2015 8:50:21 GMT -5
Honorable Mentions. AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees - Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera Orioles - Frank Robinson, Cal Ripken Red Sox - Carl Yastrzemski, Pedro Martinez Rays - Fred McGriff Blue Jays - Dave Stieb, Roy Halladay Tigers - Miguel Cabrera, Mickey Lolich Indians - Luis Tiant, Larry Doby White Sox - Wilbur Wood, Dick Allen Twins - Joe Mauer, Tony Oliva Royals - Willie Wilson, John Mayberry Angels - Dean Chance, Frank Tanana Athletics - Jim "Catfish" Hunter, Rollie Fingers Mariners - Randy Johnson, Ichiro Suzuki Rangers - Juan Gonzalez, Adrian Beltre Astros - Jim Wynn, Larry Dierker National LeagueNationals - Pedro Martinez (Expos), Jordan Zimmermann Braves - Eddie Mathews, Tom Glavine Mets - Keith Hernandez, Darryl Strawberry Phillies - Richie Ashburn, Roy Halladay Marlins - Josh Beckett Cardinals - Joe Torre, Ozzie Smith Pirates - Ralph Kiner, Dave Parker Reds - Ted Kluszewski, Frank Robinson Brewers - Rollie Fingers, Pete Vuckovitz Cubs - Kerry Wood, Ron Santo Dodgers - Jackie Robinson, Clayton Kershaw Giants - Juan Marichal, Gaylord Perry Diamondbacks - Randy Johnson, Paul Goldschmidt Padres - Dave Dravecky, Eric Show Rockies - Troy Tulowitzki, Andres Gallaraga A Braves list without Warren Spahn on it needs revising. He belongs next to Hank Aaron . IMO. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2015 8:52:15 GMT -5
IMO...Team ICON would be someone who, when you mention them, people are apt to think of the team they were on...Johnny Unitas immediately brings to mind the Colts...Paul Hornung the Packers...
In that frame, I could definitely see Pudge for the Rangers, but not so much Gonzales, Young or Beltre. PERHAPS young, but definitely not Beltre.
I would submit Jim Sundberg as one. Sunny was the catcher when I first started paying attention to the Rangers while living in Dallas. Nolan Ryan (just to name drop) was on too many teams for just one, but he makes me think of Houston first and then the Rangers. Jeff Borroughs is another for me. And then the great Rafael Palmeiro (his accusations being ignored by me) would round out my top four.
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 9:00:29 GMT -5
Good post. Kershaw does not deserve to be on the honorary list. It is easy to let the soup deJour get too much love. Not yet, not with that franchise and it's history. Maybe someday, maybe not. Guys like Maury Wills are way ahead of him at this point. Gil Hodges, guys from those late 70s and 80s teams and the Drysdale era. To date Kershaw is a recent regualar season wonder. He may end up the greatest of all time, but not on a list that goes back to 1946. Good point. On one hand I am arguing with Swampy that it is premature to include Giancarlo Stanton, then I have Kershaw on the HM. |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 9:01:38 GMT -5
IMO...Team ICON would be someone who, when you mention them, people are apt to think of the team they were on...Johnny Unitas immediately brings to mind the Colts...Paul Hornung the Packers...In that frame, I could definitely see Pudge for the Rangers, but not so much Gonzales, Young or Beltre. PERHAPS young, but definitely not Beltre. I would submit Jim Sundberg as one. Sunny was the catcher when I first started paying attention to the Rangers while living in Dallas. Nolan Ryan (just to name drop) was on too many teams for just one, but he makes me think of Houston first and then the Rangers. Jeff Borroughs is another for me. And then the great Rafael Palmeiro (his accusations being ignored by me) would round out my top four. That is a great point! (The bold part) |
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 14, 2015 9:32:08 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate. First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues. You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there! I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys. So here goes... AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr. White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio NATIONAL LEAGUENationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle Willis Cardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil Cooper Reds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke Snider Giants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton Debate? tigertowner68: What a Gordian Knot it really is to pick the top four for teams that have a history. And to expand it would just make it worse. It would be like college football. " we need a playoff system, two is not enough" and now " four is not enough, team five deserves to be there. And to go to eight it would be " Hey there is a ninth team as good as number eight" The what is a ICON is a good question. Then there are teams like the Washing Senators who are in Washington until 1061 and become the Twins, then start over and ten years later become the Rangers and then start over. What happens to the " lost boys" of those teams.? Harmon Killebrew, Frank Howard ( had the opportunity to talk him once, a great man), Jim Kaat. Good post. |
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 14, 2015 9:35:25 GMT -5
Uh! That would be " 1961 " In 1061 we were getting ready to go to Hastings by 1066 and then starting up a " CLub " league.
Ah! The good old days.
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 14, 2015 9:41:48 GMT -5
This is my compilation of MLB team's Icons since World War II. There is, as one would suspect, a lot of room for debate. First, I tend to lean on players that participated in great eras for their teams as a tie-breaker. Second, I did not include Pete Rose because he is banned from baseball (but I loved the guy as a player). Last, you will debate MUCH more the older established teams than you will the expansion teams, especially the teams that were charter members in their respective leagues. You will note that two former Expos greats are named as Washington Nationals. That will likely change in the near future. But not today. The Nationals are a work in progress. They could produce players that supplant the former Expos greats, but not yet. In the Rangers' case, I could have gone back to the old Washington Senators but those teams sucked so bad I chose not to. Harmon Killebrew was on the "original" Senators that became the Twins in the early 60's and he is on the Twins as a co-captain, so there! I also left out ALL of the freaking PED guys. So here goes... AMERICAN LEAGUEYankees- 1) Mickey Mantle 2) Joe Di Maggio Orioles - 1) Brooks Robinson 2) Jim Palmer Red Sox- 1) David Ortiz 2) Ted Williams Rays - 1) Evan Longoria 2) David Price Blue Jays - 1) Roberto Alomar 2) Joe Carter Tigers- 1) Hank Greenberg 2) Al Kaline Indians - 1) Bob Feller 2) Sandy Alomar, Jr. White Sox - 1) Frank Thomas 2) Luis Aparicio Twins - 1) Kirby Puckett 2) Harmon Killebrew Royals - 1) George Brett 2) Bret Saberhagen Angels - 1) Mike Trout 2) Nolan Ryan Athletics - 1) Rickey Henderson 2) Reggie Jackson Mariners - 1) Ken Griffey Jr. 2) Edgar Martinez Rangers - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Michael Young Astros - 1) Jeff Bagwell 2) Craig Biggio NATIONAL LEAGUENationals - 1) Andre Dawson 2) Tim Raines Braves - 1) Henry Aaron 2) Greg Maddux Mets - 1) Tom Seaver 2) Tug McGraw Phillies - 1) Mike Schmidt 2) Steve Carlton Marlins - 1) Ivan "Pudge" Rodriguez 2) Dontrelle Willis Cardinals - 1) Stan Musial 2) Bob Gibson Pirates- 1) Roberto Clemente 2) Willie Stargell Brewers- 1) Robin Yount 2) Cecil Cooper Reds - 1) Johnny Bench 2) Tony Perez Cubs - 1) Ernie Banks 2) Billy Williams Dodgers - 1) Sandy Koufax 2) Duke Snider Giants - 1) Willie Mays 2) Willie McCovey Diamondbacks - 1) Curt Schilling 2) Luis Gonzalez Padres - 1) Tony Gwynn 2) Randy Jones Rockies - 1) Larry Walker 2) Todd Helton Debate? tigertowner68: What a Gordian Knot it really is to pick the top four for teams that have a history. And to expand it would just make it worse. It would be like college football. " we need a playoff system, two is not enough" and now " four is not enough, team five deserves to be there. And to go to eight it would be " Hey there is a ninth team as good as number eight" The what is a ICON is a good question. Then there are teams like the Washing Senators who are in Washington until 1061 and become the Twins, then start over and ten years later become the Rangers and then start over. What happens to the " lost boys" of those teams.? Harmon Killebrew, Frank Howard ( had the opportunity to talk him once, a great man), Jim Kaat. Good post. Must have been a thrill to talk to Hondo. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 14, 2015 9:46:59 GMT -5
IMO...Team ICON would be someone who, when you mention them, people are apt to think of the team they were on...Johnny Unitas immediately brings to mind the Colts...Paul Hornung the Packers...In that frame, I could definitely see Pudge for the Rangers, but not so much Gonzales, Young or Beltre. PERHAPS young, but definitely not Beltre. I would submit Jim Sundberg as one. Sunny was the catcher when I first started paying attention to the Rangers while living in Dallas. Nolan Ryan (just to name drop) was on too many teams for just one, but he makes me think of Houston first and then the Rangers. Jeff Borroughs is another for me. And then the great Rafael Palmeiro (his accusations being ignored by me) would round out my top four. That is a great point! (The bold part) Thanks...the bold part didn't bold but I saw in the BBCode. Gotta go babysit the 1 week old grandson (along with his 4 and 7 y/o brothers) while my wife and daughter go try to find a dresser. Didn't realize little one's needed so much STUFF |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 14, 2015 11:15:45 GMT -5
Good post. Kershaw does not deserve to be on the honorary list. It is easy to let the soup deJour get too much love. Not yet, not with that franchise and it's history. Maybe someday, maybe not. Guys like Maury Wills are way ahead of him at this point. Gil Hodges, guys from those late 70s and 80s teams and the Drysdale era. To date Kershaw is a recent regualar season wonder. He may end up the greatest of all time, but not on a list that goes back to 1946. Good point. On one hand I am arguing with Swampy that it is premature to include Giancarlo Stanton, then I have Kershaw on the HM. Yes the long list of great Marlins makes that a head scratcher |
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