tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 17, 2015 12:53:45 GMT -5
Never did find my notes, so I had to work it out again...  This starting pitcher's list has to get wrapped up. Wife is still hobbled and I have sinusitis, pharyngitis, and a cough that is threatening to knock the walls down. So, I have time as long as I stay awake. Now we move into the meat of the list. Fifteen left. Thirteen are in the Hall, one is close but won't make it and one has the numbers to get in any time but he is accused widely of steroid abuse. I won't spill the beans but will tell you that I wrestled with what to do about Roger Clemens. My first impulse was to not allow him to qualify. But we are not talking about the Hall, we are just listing the top players here. I include the Rocket because his career is what it is. That and the fact that he was acquitted in a Federal trial on June 19, 2012. The prosecution made more mistakes than the Keystone Cops, and Clemens' people capitalized on them. I believe he used steroids. The trial was actually about whether or not he lied to Congress about it though. I can't stand Clemens even without all the steroid hoopla. My brightest memories were of him striking out 20 Mariners in 1986, then 20 Tigers ten years later in 1996. Only the Cubs' Kerry Wood has equaled that feat. But that memory has been preempted by the vivid images of a poor sportsman Rocket angrily hurling the jagged shards of Mike Piazza's broken bat at Mike. Roid rage? You can make the call. Anyway, nuff chatter. Here is #11-#15. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. Career World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. Career World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. Career World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. Next... the Top Ten Starting Pitchers of the Last 50 years. Starting pitchers' series to conclude Thursday. |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 17, 2015 14:57:43 GMT -5
Never did find my notes, so I had to work it out again... This starting pitcher's list has to get wrapped up. Wife is still hobbled and I have sinusitis, pharyngitis, and a cough that is threatening to knock the walls down. So, I have time as long as I stay awake. Now we move into the meat of the list. Fifteen left. Thirteen are in the Hall, one is close but won't make it and one has the numbers to get in any time but he is accused widely of steroid abuse. I won't spill the beans but will tell you that I wrestled with what to do about Roger Clemens. My first impulse was to not allow him to qualify. But we are not talking about the Hall, we are just listing the top players here. I include the Rocket because his career is what it is. That and the fact that he was acquitted in a Federal trial on June 19, 2012. The prosecution made more mistakes than the Keystone Cops, and Clemens' people capitalized on them. I believe he used steroids. The trial was actually about whether or not he lied to Congress about it though. I can't stand Clemens even without all the steroid hoopla. My brightest memories were of him striking out 20 Mariners in 1986, then 20 Tigers ten years later in 1996. Only the Cubs' Kerry Wood has equaled that feat. But that memory has been preempted by the vivid images of a poor sportsman Rocket angrily hurling the jagged shards of Mike Piazza's broken bat at Mike. Roid rage? You can make the call. Anyway, nuff chatter. Here is #11-#15. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. Career World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. Career World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. Career World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. Next... the Top Ten Starting Pitchers of the Last 50 years. Starting pitchers' series to conclude Thursday. Whom I'm betting are yet to come |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 17, 2015 15:52:19 GMT -5
Never did find my notes, so I had to work it out again... This starting pitcher's list has to get wrapped up. Wife is still hobbled and I have sinusitis, pharyngitis, and a cough that is threatening to knock the walls down. So, I have time as long as I stay awake. Now we move into the meat of the list. Fifteen left. Thirteen are in the Hall, one is close but won't make it and one has the numbers to get in any time but he is accused widely of steroid abuse. I won't spill the beans but will tell you that I wrestled with what to do about Roger Clemens. My first impulse was to not allow him to qualify. But we are not talking about the Hall, we are just listing the top players here. I include the Rocket because his career is what it is. That and the fact that he was acquitted in a Federal trial on June 19, 2012. The prosecution made more mistakes than the Keystone Cops, and Clemens' people capitalized on them. I believe he used steroids. The trial was actually about whether or not he lied to Congress about it though. I can't stand Clemens even without all the steroid hoopla. My brightest memories were of him striking out 20 Mariners in 1986, then 20 Tigers ten years later in 1996. Only the Cubs' Kerry Wood has equaled that feat. But that memory has been preempted by the vivid images of a poor sportsman Rocket angrily hurling the jagged shards of Mike Piazza's broken bat at Mike. Roid rage? You can make the call. Anyway, nuff chatter. Here is #11-#15. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. Career World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. Career World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. Career World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. Next... the Top Ten Starting Pitchers of the Last 50 years. Starting pitchers' series to conclude Thursday. Whom I'm betting are yet to come Thinking that you have the "winning hand" Swampy... |
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 17, 2015 16:20:30 GMT -5
Great list. some names from the past. Juan Marichal. great to watch him and some of the others, they had really funky motions and high leg kicks and you did not need a number to know who was pitching most days. their windup was their signature.
Not crying about these new guys or anything, just saying the game is cookie cutter today. most hitters and pitchers all have the same stance and windups. Techno progress I suppose.
just sayin'
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 17, 2015 16:40:25 GMT -5
Whom I'm betting are yet to come Thinking that you have the "winning hand" Swampy... Oh I'm pretty sure I can recite your top ten More wondering if Lefty or Unit or both get ahead of Sandor in your list (of lefties that is ) |
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Post by aka50yearfan on Feb 17, 2015 16:45:14 GMT -5
Never did find my notes, so I had to work it out again... This starting pitcher's list has to get wrapped up. Wife is still hobbled and I have sinusitis, pharyngitis, and a cough that is threatening to knock the walls down. So, I have time as long as I stay awake. Now we move into the meat of the list. Fifteen left. Thirteen are in the Hall, one is close but won't make it and one has the numbers to get in any time but he is accused widely of steroid abuse. I won't spill the beans but will tell you that I wrestled with what to do about Roger Clemens. My first impulse was to not allow him to qualify. But we are not talking about the Hall, we are just listing the top players here. I include the Rocket because his career is what it is. That and the fact that he was acquitted in a Federal trial on June 19, 2012. The prosecution made more mistakes than the Keystone Cops, and Clemens' people capitalized on them. I believe he used steroids. The trial was actually about whether or not he lied to Congress about it though. I can't stand Clemens even without all the steroid hoopla. My brightest memories were of him striking out 20 Mariners in 1986, then 20 Tigers ten years later in 1996. Only the Cubs' Kerry Wood has equaled that feat. But that memory has been preempted by the vivid images of a poor sportsman Rocket angrily hurling the jagged shards of Mike Piazza's broken bat at Mike. Roid rage? You can make the call. Anyway, nuff chatter. Here is #11-#15. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. Career World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. Career World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. Career World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. Next... the Top Ten Starting Pitchers of the Last 50 years. Starting pitchers' series to conclude Thursday. You have to include Clemens unless you can tell me the 103 guys on that original list that tested as users. And remember, Arod and none of the other 11 guys who got suspended in the bust failed a drug test. They just used the wrong clinic. Anybody think that is the only clinic out there being used by MLB players and players from other sports is not being reasonable. Steroids goes back about 30 years now. Maybe more. I would not be shocked to learn of just about any player going back 30 plus years being "discovered" as a user of steroids. In what universe does a forty year old throw as hard as he did at twenty ( see Nolan Ryan ) or was he just an anomaly of anatomy? Now they use roches and timing and evade detection and there is not that much mystery about all those big boys coming out of the domican republic these last few years. Who watches over those health clinics? I have loved baseball since listening to the WS on the radio in 1960, but I do not believe for one minute that the game is all on the up and up now and it will not be until they change their testing methods and what they test for and the players Union wants no part of that. Jose Conseco was the only honest one in the bunch, from players to front offices to managers to owners to the commish, and they turned on him for what? Telling the truth. |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 17, 2015 16:56:15 GMT -5
Never did find my notes, so I had to work it out again... This starting pitcher's list has to get wrapped up. Wife is still hobbled and I have sinusitis, pharyngitis, and a cough that is threatening to knock the walls down. So, I have time as long as I stay awake. Now we move into the meat of the list. Fifteen left. Thirteen are in the Hall, one is close but won't make it and one has the numbers to get in any time but he is accused widely of steroid abuse. I won't spill the beans but will tell you that I wrestled with what to do about Roger Clemens. My first impulse was to not allow him to qualify. But we are not talking about the Hall, we are just listing the top players here. I include the Rocket because his career is what it is. That and the fact that he was acquitted in a Federal trial on June 19, 2012. The prosecution made more mistakes than the Keystone Cops, and Clemens' people capitalized on them. I believe he used steroids. The trial was actually about whether or not he lied to Congress about it though. I can't stand Clemens even without all the steroid hoopla. My brightest memories were of him striking out 20 Mariners in 1986, then 20 Tigers ten years later in 1996. Only the Cubs' Kerry Wood has equaled that feat. But that memory has been preempted by the vivid images of a poor sportsman Rocket angrily hurling the jagged shards of Mike Piazza's broken bat at Mike. Roid rage? You can make the call. Anyway, nuff chatter. Here is #11-#15. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. Career World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. Career World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. Career World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. Career World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. Next... the Top Ten Starting Pitchers of the Last 50 years. Starting pitchers' series to conclude Thursday. You have to include Clemens unless you can tell me the 103 guys on that original list that tested as users. And remember, Arod and none of the other 11 guys who got suspended in the bust failed a drug test. They just used the wrong clinic. Anybody think that is the only clinic out there being used by MLB players and players from other sports is not being reasonable. Steroids goes back about 30 years now. Maybe more. I would not be shocked to learn of just about any player going back 30 plus years being "discovered" as a user of steroids. In what universe does a forty year old throw as hard as he did at twenty ( see Nolan Ryan ) or was he just an anomaly of anatomy? Now they use roches and timing and evade detection and there is not that much mystery about all those big boys coming out of the domican republic these last few years. Who watches over those health clinics? I have loved baseball since listening to the WS on the radio in 1960, but I do not believe for one minute that the game is all on the up and up now and it will not be until they change their testing methods and what they test for and the players Union wants no part of that. Jose Conseco was the only honest one in the bunch, from players to front offices to managers to owners to the commish, and they turned on him for what? Telling the truth. I have to agree 50, and I do agree. That is why Clemens is on the list. Personal feelings notwithstanding. It is not my most popular pitchers' list, it is a list of the best. |
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 18, 2015 13:28:00 GMT -5
A few words before I dive into what is the list of my top ten pitchers of the last 50 years...
One, I can't believe that I am having this much fun. Maybe that makes me odd, OK, I'll be odd.
One thing I believe is hard to argue. These are the top ten of the period.If you want to tell me that Juan Marichal should be in the top ten, no argument. That is the only argument that I will accept. I'll bet we could argue until the cows come home over the order.
It boils down to "what do you want and what do you value most?". Quantity? Quality? Long term success? Dominant seasons or long term consistency? Post season brilliance? Not very fair to those that excelled but were denied the opportunities because their supporting cast did not hold up their end of the bargain (e.g. - Jenkins and Ryan). I could have cited some new SABR statistics because there is value to be had. WAR is a great one. If anybody cares to add some input utilizing any of this, go ahead.
Last of all, the question of "when" is as important here as "location" is in a discussion about real estate. The 50 year period resembles an inverted bell curve when you look at the ratio of pitching success to batting success. In 1965, pitching prowess was nearing its apex that occurred in 1968. The mound was lowered after 1968 and it had an immediate effect on the "balance". PEDs sent the balance soaring in favor of hitters during the 1990's and early 2000s. Now the curve has gone strongly back up in the pitchers' favor. Also, could it be that some of the pitchers that were so dominant in the 1990's benefited from PEDs just like the hitters? Likely.
"When" also introduces another variable. The evolution of relief pitching has rendered the "complete game" the way of the dodo bird. Modern pitchers that are certainly capable of still putting up a high number of complete games are denied the opportunity. Whether they are willing to turn the ball over to the bullpen or not.
So, that all stated, here we go...
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 18, 2015 14:38:12 GMT -5
Ten, nine, eight, seven, six...
Here they are.
10) Nolan Ryan Regular Season 324-292, 3.19 ERA, 5386 IP, 5714 K, 1.25 WHIP World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 2IP, 3K, 1.28 WHIP. Seven no hitters. 5,714 strikeouts. Tenth best? Tenth? Remember, tenth is damn good when you are talking about a 50 year span. I was most likely to want tickets when the Express was due to pitch here in Detroit than any other opposing starter. You could get a no hitter at the drop of a hat. Why not rank him higher? Too many walks and too many losses, and only a WS appearance before he became The Express (the losses are not necesarily his fault, nor is the lack of World Series play).
9) Jim Palmer Regular Season 268-152, 2.86 ERA, 3948 IP, 2212 K, 1.18 WHIP World Series 4-2, 3.20 ERA, 64 IP, 44K, 1.33 WHIP. The best of the renowned Orioles rotation of the 1960's and 70's. The man just could pitch. Great control, not all that many K's, just win baby. Cy Young winner 1973, 1975 and 1976. Auspiciously defeated the Dodgers and Sandy Koufax with a complete game shutout in game two of the 1966 World Series, part of a shocking 4 game Orioles sweep.
8) Steve Carlton Regular Season 329-244, 3.22 ERA, 5217 IP, 4136 K, 1.25 WHIP World Series 2-2, 2.56 ERA, 32 IP, 32K, 1.39 WHIP. "Lefty" won 27 games for the 1972 Phillies. The Phillies only won 54. Half the team's wins, wow...Carlton was a whole lot more than just a season though. Coming full circle from the Phils of '72, "Lefty" posted two dominant victories in the 1980 Phillies WS championship year. 1972 was but one of four Cy Young's for him. Still fourth in all-time K's, and a six time 20 game winner.
7) Pedro Martinez Regular Season 219-100, 2.93 ERA, 2827 IP, 3154 K, 1.05 WHIP World Series 1-2, 3.71 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 1.06 WHIP Remember when I was stating about how important the question of "when" is? Put up a career 2.93 ERA in that hitting era? 2000 season led AL with 1.74 ERA while pitching at Fenway. The next guy was Roger Clemens, almost two full runs above with the Yankees at 3.70. The previous year, Pedro was 23-4, 2.07 with 318 K. Of course it was a lot more than about just those two seasons but what sparkling years they were.
6) Greg Maddux Regular Season 355-227, 3.16 ERA, 5008 IP, 3371 K, 1.14 WHIP World Series 2-3, 2.09 ERA, 38 IP, 18 K, 0.91 WHIP The bespectacled Maddux looked like a math professor and put up the numbers. Possibly had the best strike zone control of any pitcher in baseball history. Four straight Cy Young awards (1992 with the Cubs,'93-95 with the Braves). Totally different pitcher in style than Pedro Martinez, similar results but better overall numbers. How's this for a run of incredible consecutive ERAs? (beginning in 1992 and ending in 1998, one of the peak seven years of batting prowess ever...2.18, 2.36, 1.56, 1.63, 2.72, 2.20, 2.22).
Tomorrow...the top five
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 19, 2015 12:52:50 GMT -5
Finally the Top 5. Briefly, I had to ask myself one question here after digesting everything else. The big tie-breaker.
"In an elimination game, be it regular season, Division Series, Championship Series, or World Series...who would I want as my starting pitcher?"
The Top 5.
5) Tom Seaver Regular Season 311-205, 2.86 ERA, 4783 IP, 3640 K, 1.12 WHIP World Series 1-2, 2.70 ERA, 30 IP, 27 K, 1.03 WHIP. How did he pile up so many wins spending the first and best half of his career with the perennially light hitting Mets? "Tom Terrific" was just that. Terrific. He was super effective and consistent, and clutch. On no other team do I believe it is as crystal clear as to who their signature player is. Five 20 win seasons, three Cy Young awards. Put up five very good years with the Reds following his Mets tenure. He was on his way to what would have been his only 20 win season in a Reds uniform when the 1981 players' strike put that out of reach. But what kind of numbers could he have put up if he had joined Cincinnati in 1972 instead of 1977? Never know...
4) Roger Clemens Regular Season 354-184, 3.12 ERA, 4916 IP, 4672 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 2.37, 49 IP, 49K, 0.99 WHIP. The "Rocket" was a ferocious competitor. When Dan Duquette called him an "old 33" and let him walk out the door to Toronto in 1996, Clemens simply rang up another 136 wins in the next eight seasons, along with four more Cy Young awards bringing him to a record 7 Cy Youngs during one of the most prolific hitting eras in baseball history. One point that many probably are unaware of: in the cumulative WAR statistic (updated May 2012) since the beginning of organized major league baseball, Clemens'(133.1) ranks 3rd among pitchers behind only Cy Young (162.3) himself, and Walter "Big Train" Johnson (144.7) source baseball-reference.com. So clearly he has a case for #1 over the last 50 years.
3) Randy Johnson Regular Season 303-166, 3.29 ERA, 4135 IP, 4875 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 1.04 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 0.69 WHIP. The "Big Unit" was possibly the most feared pitcher in baseball. Ever. Standing 6'10", the southpaw looked to batters as if he was halfway toward the plate and on top of them. Especially terrorized left handed batters, I can't even imagine him throwing off an 18" mound, can you John Kruk? Five Cy Young awards included four consecutive with the Diamondbacks 1999-2002. His K totals in those four years? How about 364, 347, 372 and 334 for a grand total of 1523 Ks in just four seasons! His work in game seven of the classic 2001 World Series vs. the Yankees was unprecedented, coming off zero rest the day after winning game six and throwing an inning and a third of perfect relief to take the win after Arizona rallied to beat the great Mariano Rivera.
2) Bob Gibson Regular Season 251-174, 2.91 ERA, 3884 IP, 3117 K, 1.19 WHIP World Series 7-2, 1.89 ERA, 81 IP, 92 K, 0.89 WHIP. "Gibby" along with Don Drysdale, made batters more uncomfortable digging in at the plate than almost anyone before or since. His 1968 regular season of 22-9, 1.12 ERA, earning him one of his two Cy Youngs and aa league MVP. That may be the best single pitching season of the modern era. The year of the pitcher also featured Denny McLain winning 31 games, a feat that had not been pulled off since 1934 or since. But to me, Gibson's year was even better. How do you lose 9 games with an ERA of 1.12? "Hoot" began "practicing" as a World Series pitcher against the last of the great Yankees teams of the 1960s in 1964. He was the series MVP (2-1, 3.00) and that was his worst series of three! He dominated the Red Sox in 1967 going 3-0, 1.00 and winning another WS MVP. He set the single game strikeout record in game 1 against the Tigers the next season (the remarkable '68) with 17. Finally, it took a few ill conceived steps forward by normally deadly reliable CF Curt Flood to dent him for a Tigers' Jim Northrup triple, breaking a scoreless tie while knocking in two runs. Difficult guy to beat in the clutch? You think?
1) Sandy Koufax Regular Season 165-87, 2.76, 2324 IP, 2396 K, 1.11 WHIP. World Series 4-3, 0.95 ERA, 57 IP, 61 K, 0.82 WHIP. "The Left Arm of God" took some time harnessing his incredible fastball and what may have been the best curveball anyone ever possessed. He was so frustrated he thought about quitting prior to the 1961 season. Then he put it all together. Sure the move to Chavez Ravine in 1962 helped, but he would have been invincible in any park through 1966, when he had to retire at age 31. His arm was so ravaged by arthritis and hemorrhaging that it would be black and blue. His record in the four utterly dominant seasons '62, 63, 65 and 66 is 112-34 (Averaging 22-7 a season). He was named the National League's Most Valuable Player in 1963. He won the 1963, 1965, and 1966 Cy Young Awards by unanimous votes, at the time making him then the first three-time Cy Young winner in baseball history. He is also the only pitcher to win the award three times when the award was for all of baseball, not just one league. In each of his Cy Young seasons, Koufax won the pitcher's triple crown by leading the NL in wins, strikeouts, and earned run average. Koufax's totals would also have led the American League in those seasons. I have to admit that I was too young to see him pitch live, but after viewing World Series footage at age 16 including game seven of the '65 World Series vs. the Twins, I have never witnessed such complete and utter dominance including such similar instances by Gibson, Randy Johnson and Jack Morris, to name just a few. Koufax is "my man" for the most crucial game every time.
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tigertowner 68
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Post by tigertowner 68 on Feb 19, 2015 12:57:34 GMT -5
The Top Starting Pitchers of the last 50 years list from #1 - #28... Bold = Hall of Fame Member
28) Jack Morris Career regular season 254-186, 3.90 ERA, 3824 IP, 2478K, 1.30 WHIP. World Series 4-2, 2.96 ERA , 52IP, 40K, 1.20 WHIP. Dude would have probably been a lock for the HOF without that unsightly ERA. Great competitor. Abrasive mother. Will never forget his 10 inning masterpiece in 1991 Series. Even though it was for the Twins and not my home team.
27) Fernando Valenzuela Career regular season 173-153, 3.54 ERA, 2930 IP, 2074K , 1.32 WHIP. World Series 1-0, 4.00 ERA, 9 IP, 6K, 1.78 WHIP. He was such a phenomenon in the early 1980's, leading the Dodgers to the championship in his first full season in 1981, along with a Cy Young award. Major contributor through the late 1980's.
26) Vida Blue Career regular season 209-161, 3.27 ERA, 3343 IP, 2175K, 1.23 WHIP. World Series 0-3, 4.05 ERA, 33 IP, 22K, 1.29 WHIP. Another overnight sensation. Won Cy Young award in first full season (24-8, 1.82 ERA, 301K). One of three 20 win seasons. Cocaine use sullies his rep.
25) Mickey Lolich Career regular season 217-191, 3.44 ERA, 3638 IP, 2832K, 1.23 WHIP. World Series 3-0 1.67 ERA, 27 IP, 21K, 0.98 WHIP. Steady performer who was otherworldly in 1968 Series, (3 CG wins, the last vs Bob Gibson, also hit only career HR in series). Lost a tight duel for Cy in 1971 with Vida Blue. Mick (25-14, 2.92 ungodly 376 IP, 308K) followed with 22-14, 2.50 in 1972 and then went downhill.
24) Roy Halladay Career regular season 203-105, 3.38 ERA, 2749 IP, 2117K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 1-1, 4.15 ERA, 13 IP, 12K, 1.23 WHIP. Put together three 20 win seasons and two 19 win seasons. I am not including NLCS or NLDS, but he threw a no-hitter vs. the Reds in 2010 NLDS.
23) Mike Mussina Career regular season 270-153, 3.68 ERA, 3562 IP, 2813K, 1.19 WHIP. World Series 1-1, 3.00 ERA, 18 IP, 23K, 1.28 WHIP. Mister consistency with the Orioles for ten years, then starred with the Yankees. Remarkably had seven years of 17 or more wins, then retired in 2008 with a career high 20-8. Talk about going out on top...
22) Don Sutton Career regular season 324-256, 3.26 ERA, 5282 IP, 3574K, 1.14 WHIP. World Series 2-3, 5.26 ERA, 51 IP, 33K, 1.25 WHIP. A clone of Mike Mussina (or vice-versa). One season over 20 wins (1976, 21-10) but seven others of 17 or more. What does 22 years of sustained consistent quality get you? The Hall of Fame.
21) Curt Schilling Career regular season 216-146, 3.46 ERA, 3261 IP, 3116 K, 1.13 WHIP. World Series 4-1, 2.06 ERA, 48 IP, 43K, 0.90 WHIP. Curt endured a rocky start before exploding into prominence with Arizona and Boston. Especially post season. The "Bloody Sock" game in the Red Sox miraculous comeback ALCS of 2004 was quite a story too.
20) Gaylord Perry Career regular season 314-265, 3.11 ERA, 5350 IP, 3534 K, 1.18 WHIP. (no World Series) Gaylord put up these sterling numbers with 9 teams. The vagabond of pitchers, he might have ranked higher if not for liberal use of Vaseline and other slippery substances. If you aint cheating, you aint trying. LOL.
19) Fergie Jenkins Career regular season 284-226, 3.34 ERA, 4500 IP, 3192 K, 1.14 WHIP. (no World Series) Pitching the bulk of his career out of Wrigley, the ERA and WHIP become even more impressive. Put up numerous 20 win seasons in both Chicago and Texas.
18) Luis Tiant Career regular season 229-172, 3.30 ERA, 3486 IP, 2410 K, 1.20 WHIP. World Series 2-0, 3.62 ERA, 25 IP, 12K, 1.32 WHIP. The ranking may be a bit high, but I probably bias things somewhat when I saw a lot of a pitcher. Well, I saw a lot of Luis and liked most all of what I saw.
17) Don Drysdale Career regular season 209-166, 2.95 ERA, 3432 IP, 2486 K, 1.15 WHIP. World Series 3-3, 2.95 ERA, 40 IP, 36 K, 1.21 WHIP. Drysdale is a polarizing figure. His W-L is mediocre, but he pitched for Dodgers teams that were very offensively challenged (except the '62 edition). At the same time the ERA is outstanding, but again a caveat...he pitched in a pitcher's park beginning in 1962 (LA Coliseum from 1958-61 was no such thing though...).For years he held the record for consecutive scoreless innings pitched. He was a prototypical power pitcher, and I like those. The era also produced historically low run production. He did retire to pursue acting at age 33 though, and had he continued, the wins would be higher. Bill James devotes an entire chapter to "Big D" in his excellent book about the Hall of Fame (The Politics of Glory, 1994). Good reading.
16) Bert Blyleven Career regular season 287-250, 3.31 ERA, 4970 IP, 3701 K, 1.20 WHIP. World Series 2-1, 2.35 ERA, 23 IP, 16 K, 1.15 WHIP. Took a while to get in the Hall. Why, I don't know. The curveball was legendary and the guy put in a good 22 years. Only won 20 once, but every other stat is worthy.
15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA.
14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets.
13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year.
12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era.
11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say.
10) Nolan Ryan Career Regular Season 324-292, 3.19 ERA, 5386 IP, 5714 K, 1.25 WHIP. World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 2IP, 3K, 1.28 WHIP. Seven no hitters. 5,714 strikeouts. Tenth best? Tenth? Remember, tenth is damn good when you are talking about a 50 year span. I was most likely to want tickets when the Express was due to pitch here in Detroit than any other opposing starter. You could get a no hitter at the drop of a hat. Why not rank him higher? Too many walks and too many losses, and only a WS appearance before he became The Express (the losses are not necesarily his fault, nor is the lack of World Series play).
9) Jim Palmer Regular Season 268-152, 2.86 ERA, 3948 IP, 2212 K, 1.18 WHIP World Series 4-2, 3.20 ERA, 64 IP, 44K, 1.33 WHIP. The best of the renowned Orioles rotation of the 1960's and 70's. The man just could pitch. Great control, not all that many K's, just win baby. Cy Young winner 1973, 1975 and 1976. Auspiciously defeated the Dodgers and Sandy Koufax with a complete game shutout in game two of the 1966 World Series, part of a shocking 4 game Orioles sweep.
8) Steve Carlton Regular Season 329-244, 3.22 ERA, 5217 IP, 4136 K, 1.25 WHIP World Series 2-2, 2.56 ERA, 32 IP, 32K, 1.39 WHIP. "Lefty" won 27 games for the 1972 Phillies. The Phillies only won 54. Half the team's wins, wow...Carlton was a whole lot more than just a season though. Coming full circle from the Phils of '72, "Lefty" posted two dominant victories in the 1980 Phillies WS championship year. 1972 was but one of four Cy Young's for him. Still fourth in all-time K's, and a six time 20 game winner.
7) Pedro Martinez Regular Season 219-100, 2.93 ERA, 2827 IP, 3154 K, 1.05 WHIP World Series 1-2, 3.71 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 1.06 WHIP Remember when I was stating about how important the question of "when" is? Put up a career 2.93 ERA in that hitting era? 2000 season led AL with 1.74 ERA while pitching at Fenway. The next guy was Roger Clemens, almost two full runs above with the Yankees at 3.70. The previous year, Pedro was 23-4, 2.07 with 318 K. Of course it was a lot more than about just those two seasons but what sparkling years they were.
6) Greg Maddux Regular Season 355-227, 3.16 ERA, 5008 IP, 3371 K, 1.14 WHIP World Series 2-3, 2.09 ERA, 38 IP, 18 K, 0.91 WHIP The bespectacled Maddux looked like a math professor and put up the numbers. Possibly had the best strike zone control of any pitcher in baseball history. Four straight Cy Young awards (1992 with the Cubs,'93-95 with the Braves). Totally different pitcher in style than Pedro Martinez, similar results but better overall numbers. How's this for a run of incredible consecutive ERAs? (beginning in 1992 and ending in 1998, one of the peak seven years of batting prowess ever...2.18, 2.36, 1.56, 1.63, 2.72, 2.20, 2.22).
5) Tom Seaver Regular Season 311-205, 2.86 ERA, 4783 IP, 3640 K, 1.12 WHIP World Series 1-2, 2.70 ERA, 30 IP, 27 K, 1.03 WHIP. How did he pile up so many wins spending the first and best half of his career with the perennially light hitting Mets? "Tom Terrific" was just that. Terrific. He was super effective and consistent, and clutch. On no other team do I believe it is as crystal clear as to who their signature player is. Five 20 win seasons, three Cy Young awards. Put up five very good years with the Reds following his Mets tenure. He was on his way to what would have been his only 20 win season in a Reds uniform when the 1981 players' strike put that out of reach. But what kind of numbers could he have put up if he had joined Cincinnati in 1972 instead of 1977? Never know...
4) Roger Clemens Regular Season 354-184, 3.12 ERA, 4916 IP, 4672 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 2.37, 49 IP, 49K, 0.99 WHIP. The "Rocket" was a ferocious competitor. When Dan Duquette called him an "old 33" and let him walk out the door to Toronto in 1996, Clemens simply rang up another 136 wins in the next eight seasons, along with four more Cy Young awards bringing him to a record 7 Cy Youngs during one of the most prolific hitting eras in baseball history. One point that many probably are unaware of: in the cumulative WAR statistic (updated May 2012) since the beginning of organized major league baseball, Clemens'(133.1) ranks 3rd among pitchers behind only Cy Young (162.3) himself, and Walter "Big Train" Johnson (144.7) source baseball-reference.com. So clearly he has a case for #1 over the last 50 years.
3) Randy Johnson Regular Season 303-166, 3.29 ERA, 4135 IP, 4875 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 1.04 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 0.69 WHIP. The "Big Unit" was possibly the most feared pitcher in baseball. Ever. Standing 6'10", the southpaw looked to batters as if he was halfway toward the plate and on top of them. Especially terrorized left handed batters, I can't even imagine him throwing off an 18" mound, can you John Kruk? Five Cy Young awards included four consecutive with the Diamondbacks 1999-2002. His K totals in those four years? How about 364, 347, 372 and 334 for a grand total of 1523 Ks in just four seasons! His work in game seven of the classic 2001 World Series vs. the Yankees was unprecedented, coming off zero rest the day after winning game six and throwing an inning and a third of perfect relief to take the win after Arizona rallied to beat the great Mariano Rivera.
2) Bob Gibson Regular Season 251-174, 2.91 ERA, 3884 IP, 3117 K, 1.19 WHIP World Series 7-2, 1.89 ERA, 81 IP, 92 K, 0.89 WHIP. "Gibby" along with Don Drysdale, made batters more uncomfortable digging in at the plate than almost anyone before or since. His 1968 regular season of 22-9, 1.12 ERA, earning him one of his two Cy Youngs and aa league MVP. That may be the best single pitching season of the modern era. The year of the pitcher also featured Denny McLain winning 31 games, a feat that had not been pulled off since 1934 or since. But to me, Gibson's year was even better. How do you lose 9 games with an ERA of 1.12? "Hoot" began "practicing" as a World Series pitcher against the last of the great Yankees teams of the 1960s in 1964. He was the series MVP (2-1, 3.00) and that was his worst series of three! He dominated the Red Sox in 1967 going 3-0, 1.00 and winning another WS MVP. He set the single game strikeout record in game 1 against the Tigers the next season (the remarkable '68) with 17. Finally, it took a few ill conceived steps forward by normally deadly reliable CF Curt Flood to dent him for a Tigers' Jim Northrup triple, breaking a scoreless tie while knocking in two runs. Difficult guy to beat in the clutch? You think?
1) Sandy Koufax Regular Season 165-87, 2.76, 2324 IP, 2396 K, 1.11 WHIP. World Series 4-3, 0.95 ERA, 57 IP, 61 K, 0.82 WHIP. "The Left Arm of God" took some time harnessing his incredible fastball and what may have been the best curveball anyone ever possessed. He was so frustrated he thought about quitting prior to the 1961 season. Then he put it all together. Sure the move to Chavez Ravine in 1962 helped, but he would have been invincible in any park through 1966, when he had to retire at age 31. His arm was so ravaged by arthritis and hemorrhaging that it would be black and blue. His record in the four utterly dominant seasons '62, 63, 65 and 66 is 112-34 over five years from '62-'66 (Averaging 22-7 a season). He was named the National League's Most Valuable Player in 1963. He won the 1963, 1965, and 1966 Cy Young Awards by unanimous votes, at the time making him then the first three-time Cy Young winner in baseball history. He is also the only pitcher to win the award three times when the award was for all of baseball, not just one league. In each of his Cy Young seasons, Koufax won the pitcher's triple crown by leading the NL in wins, strikeouts, and earned run average. Koufax's totals would also have led the American League in those seasons. I have to admit that I was too young to see him pitch live, but after viewing World Series footage at age 16 including game seven of the '65 World Series vs. the Twins, I have never witnessed such complete and utter dominance including such similar instances by Gibson, Randy Johnson and Jack Morris, to name just a few. Koufax is "my man" for the most crucial game every time.
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Feb 21, 2015 19:42:41 GMT -5
The Top Starting Pitchers of the last 50 years list from #1 - #28... Bold = Hall of Fame Member 28) Jack Morris Career regular season 254-186, 3.90 ERA, 3824 IP, 2478K, 1.30 WHIP. World Series 4-2, 2.96 ERA , 52IP, 40K, 1.20 WHIP. Dude would have probably been a lock for the HOF without that unsightly ERA. Great competitor. Abrasive mother. Will never forget his 10 inning masterpiece in 1991 Series. Even though it was for the Twins and not my home team. 27) Fernando Valenzuela Career regular season 173-153, 3.54 ERA, 2930 IP, 2074K , 1.32 WHIP. World Series 1-0, 4.00 ERA, 9 IP, 6K, 1.78 WHIP. He was such a phenomenon in the early 1980's, leading the Dodgers to the championship in his first full season in 1981, along with a Cy Young award. Major contributor through the late 1980's. 26) Vida Blue Career regular season 209-161, 3.27 ERA, 3343 IP, 2175K, 1.23 WHIP. World Series 0-3, 4.05 ERA, 33 IP, 22K, 1.29 WHIP. Another overnight sensation. Won Cy Young award in first full season (24-8, 1.82 ERA, 301K). One of three 20 win seasons. Cocaine use sullies his rep. 25) Mickey Lolich Career regular season 217-191, 3.44 ERA, 3638 IP, 2832K, 1.23 WHIP. World Series 3-0 1.67 ERA, 27 IP, 21K, 0.98 WHIP. Steady performer who was otherworldly in 1968 Series, (3 CG wins, the last vs Bob Gibson, also hit only career HR in series). Lost a tight duel for Cy in 1971 with Vida Blue. Mick (25-14, 2.92 ungodly 376 IP, 308K) followed with 22-14, 2.50 in 1972 and then went downhill. 24) Roy Halladay Career regular season 203-105, 3.38 ERA, 2749 IP, 2117K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 1-1, 4.15 ERA, 13 IP, 12K, 1.23 WHIP. Put together three 20 win seasons and two 19 win seasons. I am not including NLCS or NLDS, but he threw a no-hitter vs. the Reds in 2010 NLDS. 23) Mike Mussina Career regular season 270-153, 3.68 ERA, 3562 IP, 2813K, 1.19 WHIP. World Series 1-1, 3.00 ERA, 18 IP, 23K, 1.28 WHIP. Mister consistency with the Orioles for ten years, then starred with the Yankees. Remarkably had seven years of 17 or more wins, then retired in 2008 with a career high 20-8. Talk about going out on top... 22) Don Sutton Career regular season 324-256, 3.26 ERA, 5282 IP, 3574K, 1.14 WHIP. World Series 2-3, 5.26 ERA, 51 IP, 33K, 1.25 WHIP. A clone of Mike Mussina (or vice-versa). One season over 20 wins (1976, 21-10) but seven others of 17 or more. What does 22 years of sustained consistent quality get you? The Hall of Fame. 21) Curt Schilling Career regular season 216-146, 3.46 ERA, 3261 IP, 3116 K, 1.13 WHIP. World Series 4-1, 2.06 ERA, 48 IP, 43K, 0.90 WHIP. Curt endured a rocky start before exploding into prominence with Arizona and Boston. Especially post season. The "Bloody Sock" game in the Red Sox miraculous comeback ALCS of 2004 was quite a story too. 20) Gaylord Perry Career regular season 314-265, 3.11 ERA, 5350 IP, 3534 K, 1.18 WHIP. (no World Series) Gaylord put up these sterling numbers with 9 teams. The vagabond of pitchers, he might have ranked higher if not for liberal use of Vaseline and other slippery substances. If you aint cheating, you aint trying. LOL. 19) Fergie Jenkins Career regular season 284-226, 3.34 ERA, 4500 IP, 3192 K, 1.14 WHIP. (no World Series) Pitching the bulk of his career out of Wrigley, the ERA and WHIP become even more impressive. Put up numerous 20 win seasons in both Chicago and Texas. 18) Luis Tiant Career regular season 229-172, 3.30 ERA, 3486 IP, 2410 K, 1.20 WHIP. World Series 2-0, 3.62 ERA, 25 IP, 12K, 1.32 WHIP. The ranking may be a bit high, but I probably bias things somewhat when I saw a lot of a pitcher. Well, I saw a lot of Luis and liked most all of what I saw. 17) Don Drysdale Career regular season 209-166, 2.95 ERA, 3432 IP, 2486 K, 1.15 WHIP. World Series 3-3, 2.95 ERA, 40 IP, 36 K, 1.21 WHIP. Drysdale is a polarizing figure. His W-L is mediocre, but he pitched for Dodgers teams that were very offensively challenged (except the '62 edition). At the same time the ERA is outstanding, but again a caveat...he pitched in a pitcher's park beginning in 1962 (LA Coliseum from 1958-61 was no such thing though...).For years he held the record for consecutive scoreless innings pitched. He was a prototypical power pitcher, and I like those. The era also produced historically low run production. He did retire to pursue acting at age 33 though, and had he continued, the wins would be higher. Bill James devotes an entire chapter to "Big D" in his excellent book about the Hall of Fame (The Politics of Glory, 1994). Good reading. 16) Bert Blyleven Career regular season 287-250, 3.31 ERA, 4970 IP, 3701 K, 1.20 WHIP. World Series 2-1, 2.35 ERA, 23 IP, 16 K, 1.15 WHIP. Took a while to get in the Hall. Why, I don't know. The curveball was legendary and the guy put in a good 22 years. Only won 20 once, but every other stat is worthy. 15) Ron Guidry Career Regular Season 170-91, 3.29 ERA, 2392 IP, 1778 K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 3-1, 1.69 ERA, 22 IP, 26 K, 1.06 WHIP. His totals are not huge, but the WHIP is excellent, the winning percentage Koufax-esque. Many good seasons and a great one (1978), went 25-3, 1.74 ERA. 14) Tom Glavine Career Regular Season 305-203, 3.54 ERA, 4413 IP, 2607K, 1.14 WHIP. World Series 4-3, 2.16 ERA, 58 IP, 38K, 0.91 WHIP. Mr. Consistency. Put these numbers up in a predominantly high octane offensive era. ERA a bit high, but took a huge hit in his last six years with the Mets. 13) Catfish Hunter Career Regular Season 224-166, 3.26 ERA, 3449 IP, 2012 K, 1.13 WHIP. World Series 5-3, 3.29 ERA, 63 IP, 33K, 1.18 WHIP. Hunter's career is solid, but he was in his heyday 1971- 1975. Won 20 or more each of the five consecutive seasons (4 with Oakland and 1975 with the Yankees). Took home the Cy Young in '74 with the A's (25-12, 2.49 ERA), and was in the top four in Cy voting each year. 12) John Smoltz Career Regular Season 213-155, 3.33 ERA, 3473 IP, 3084 K, 1.18 WHIP. World Series 2-2, 2.47 ERA, 51 IP, 52 K, 1.28 WHIP. This one hurts a little, as my hometown team traded him for a one-year rental (Doyle Alexander). Smoltzie was dominant. Won Cy Young in 1996 (24-8, 2.94). Went to the bullpen after a serious injury that caused him to miss all of 2000. How'd he do? I'd say "smashing" as he put up 114 saves before rejoining the rotation in 2005. Another guy that pitched lights out in a dominant hitting era. 11) Juan Marichal Career Regular Season 243-142, 2.89 ERA, 3507 IP, 2303 K, 1.10 WHIP. World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 4 IP, 4H, 1.00 WHIP. The high leg kick was his mesmerizing trademark. A totally dominant pitcher, how about a career 2.89 ERA! Sure, it occurred in a lighter hitting era but that is still special. This man won 20 games or more eight straight seasons (including 25 in 1963 and 1966, and 26 in 1968). Never won a Cy Young award (incredibly) but he was up against Koufax, Gibson, and Seaver. Made it tough I'd say. 10) Nolan Ryan Career Regular Season 324-292, 3.19 ERA, 5386 IP, 5714 K, 1.25 WHIP. World Series 0-0, 0.00 ERA, 2IP, 3K, 1.28 WHIP. Seven no hitters. 5,714 strikeouts. Tenth best? Tenth? Remember, tenth is damn good when you are talking about a 50 year span. I was most likely to want tickets when the Express was due to pitch here in Detroit than any other opposing starter. You could get a no hitter at the drop of a hat. Why not rank him higher? Too many walks and too many losses, and only a WS appearance before he became The Express (the losses are not necesarily his fault, nor is the lack of World Series play). 9) Jim Palmer Regular Season 268-152, 2.86 ERA, 3948 IP, 2212 K, 1.18 WHIP World Series 4-2, 3.20 ERA, 64 IP, 44K, 1.33 WHIP. The best of the renowned Orioles rotation of the 1960's and 70's. The man just could pitch. Great control, not all that many K's, just win baby. Cy Young winner 1973, 1975 and 1976. Auspiciously defeated the Dodgers and Sandy Koufax with a complete game shutout in game two of the 1966 World Series, part of a shocking 4 game Orioles sweep. 8) Steve Carlton Regular Season 329-244, 3.22 ERA, 5217 IP, 4136 K, 1.25 WHIP World Series 2-2, 2.56 ERA, 32 IP, 32K, 1.39 WHIP. "Lefty" won 27 games for the 1972 Phillies. The Phillies only won 54. Half the team's wins, wow...Carlton was a whole lot more than just a season though. Coming full circle from the Phils of '72, "Lefty" posted two dominant victories in the 1980 Phillies WS championship year. 1972 was but one of four Cy Young's for him. Still fourth in all-time K's, and a six time 20 game winner. 7) Pedro Martinez Regular Season 219-100, 2.93 ERA, 2827 IP, 3154 K, 1.05 WHIP World Series 1-2, 3.71 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 1.06 WHIP Remember when I was stating about how important the question of "when" is? Put up a career 2.93 ERA in that hitting era? 2000 season led AL with 1.74 ERA while pitching at Fenway. The next guy was Roger Clemens, almost two full runs above with the Yankees at 3.70. The previous year, Pedro was 23-4, 2.07 with 318 K. Of course it was a lot more than about just those two seasons but what sparkling years they were. 6) Greg Maddux Regular Season 355-227, 3.16 ERA, 5008 IP, 3371 K, 1.14 WHIP World Series 2-3, 2.09 ERA, 38 IP, 18 K, 0.91 WHIP The bespectacled Maddux looked like a math professor and put up the numbers. Possibly had the best strike zone control of any pitcher in baseball history. Four straight Cy Young awards (1992 with the Cubs,'93-95 with the Braves). Totally different pitcher in style than Pedro Martinez, similar results but better overall numbers. How's this for a run of incredible consecutive ERAs? (beginning in 1992 and ending in 1998, one of the peak seven years of batting prowess ever...2.18, 2.36, 1.56, 1.63, 2.72, 2.20, 2.22). 5) Tom Seaver Regular Season 311-205, 2.86 ERA, 4783 IP, 3640 K, 1.12 WHIP World Series 1-2, 2.70 ERA, 30 IP, 27 K, 1.03 WHIP. How did he pile up so many wins spending the first and best half of his career with the perennially light hitting Mets? "Tom Terrific" was just that. Terrific. He was super effective and consistent, and clutch. On no other team do I believe it is as crystal clear as to who their signature player is. Five 20 win seasons, three Cy Young awards. Put up five very good years with the Reds following his Mets tenure. He was on his way to what would have been his only 20 win season in a Reds uniform when the 1981 players' strike put that out of reach. But what kind of numbers could he have put up if he had joined Cincinnati in 1972 instead of 1977? Never know... 4) Roger Clemens Regular Season 354-184, 3.12 ERA, 4916 IP, 4672 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 2.37, 49 IP, 49K, 0.99 WHIP. The "Rocket" was a ferocious competitor. When Dan Duquette called him an "old 33" and let him walk out the door to Toronto in 1996, Clemens simply rang up another 136 wins in the next eight seasons, along with four more Cy Young awards bringing him to a record 7 Cy Youngs during one of the most prolific hitting eras in baseball history. One point that many probably are unaware of: in the cumulative WAR statistic (updated May 2012) since the beginning of organized major league baseball, Clemens'(133.1) ranks 3rd among pitchers behind only Cy Young (162.3) himself, and Walter "Big Train" Johnson (144.7) source baseball-reference.com. So clearly he has a case for #1 over the last 50 years. 3) Randy Johnson Regular Season 303-166, 3.29 ERA, 4135 IP, 4875 K, 1.17 WHIP World Series 3-0, 1.04 ERA, 17 IP, 19 K, 0.69 WHIP. The "Big Unit" was possibly the most feared pitcher in baseball. Ever. Standing 6'10", the southpaw looked to batters as if he was halfway toward the plate and on top of them. Especially terrorized left handed batters, I can't even imagine him throwing off an 18" mound, can you John Kruk? Five Cy Young awards included four consecutive with the Diamondbacks 1999-2002. His K totals in those four years? How about 364, 347, 372 and 334 for a grand total of 1523 Ks in just four seasons! His work in game seven of the classic 2001 World Series vs. the Yankees was unprecedented, coming off zero rest the day after winning game six and throwing an inning and a third of perfect relief to take the win after Arizona rallied to beat the great Mariano Rivera. 2) Bob Gibson Regular Season 251-174, 2.91 ERA, 3884 IP, 3117 K, 1.19 WHIP World Series 7-2, 1.89 ERA, 81 IP, 92 K, 0.89 WHIP. "Gibby" along with Don Drysdale, made batters more uncomfortable digging in at the plate than almost anyone before or since. His 1968 regular season of 22-9, 1.12 ERA, earning him one of his two Cy Youngs and aa league MVP. That may be the best single pitching season of the modern era. The year of the pitcher also featured Denny McLain winning 31 games, a feat that had not been pulled off since 1934 or since. But to me, Gibson's year was even better. How do you lose 9 games with an ERA of 1.12? "Hoot" began "practicing" as a World Series pitcher against the last of the great Yankees teams of the 1960s in 1964. He was the series MVP (2-1, 3.00) and that was his worst series of three! He dominated the Red Sox in 1967 going 3-0, 1.00 and winning another WS MVP. He set the single game strikeout record in game 1 against the Tigers the next season (the remarkable '68) with 17. Finally, it took a few ill conceived steps forward by normally deadly reliable CF Curt Flood to dent him for a Tigers' Jim Northrup triple, breaking a scoreless tie while knocking in two runs. Difficult guy to beat in the clutch? You think? 1) Sandy Koufax Regular Season 165-87, 2.76, 2324 IP, 2396 K, 1.11 WHIP. World Series 4-3, 0.95 ERA, 57 IP, 61 K, 0.82 WHIP. "The Left Arm of God" took some time harnessing his incredible fastball and what may have been the best curveball anyone ever possessed. He was so frustrated he thought about quitting prior to the 1961 season. Then he put it all together. Sure the move to Chavez Ravine in 1962 helped, but he would have been invincible in any park through 1966, when he had to retire at age 31. His arm was so ravaged by arthritis and hemorrhaging that it would be black and blue. His record in the four utterly dominant seasons '62, 63, 65 and 66 is 112-34 over five years from '62-'66 (Averaging 22-7 a season). He was named the National League's Most Valuable Player in 1963. He won the 1963, 1965, and 1966 Cy Young Awards by unanimous votes, at the time making him then the first three-time Cy Young winner in baseball history. He is also the only pitcher to win the award three times when the award was for all of baseball, not just one league. In each of his Cy Young seasons, Koufax won the pitcher's triple crown by leading the NL in wins, strikeouts, and earned run average. Koufax's totals would also have led the American League in those seasons. I have to admit that I was too young to see him pitch live, but after viewing World Series footage at age 16 including game seven of the '65 World Series vs. the Twins, I have never witnessed such complete and utter dominance including such similar instances by Gibson, Randy Johnson and Jack Morris, to name just a few. Koufax is "my man" for the most crucial game every time. I would have Seaver a little lower Halladay a lot higher but all in all a great list |
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