Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 18, 2015 7:19:30 GMT -5
I have some seriously mixed feelings on this. Dude can play. Absolutely no question about his on-field skills and ability to be a force on a team whose deficiencies in rushing the QB are well documented. It's an immediate upgrade and one that improves every facet of the defense... and - with the right addition of young players from the draft - could make our defense seriously formidable again with Marinelli running the show.
The off-the-field stuff is there for everyone to see. It's reprehensible. The ESPN OTL report on his incident is beyond disturbing. He will be suspended once he signs with someone... and it almost has to be 6 games based on precedent alone. The fact that his coaches at Ol' Miss essentially told people scouting him before his draft that "you don't want this guy" is a searing indictment. He would appear to be everything you would walk away from under Garrett's statements and perspectives around "the right kind of guy" in the room.
Personally - I'm OK with signing the guy. Place the proper verbiage in his contract that protects the team should he do something stupid... make it a "prove it" contract similar to what was given Melton last year. Get the agent (although I don't know that this is in Rosenhaus' DNA) to have his client attend some type of domestic abuse forum (whatever that might be) to see if he truly "gets it". Press on. I don't mind second chances as long as the recipient understands he or she isn't exempt from the norms of society. And - domestic abuse shouldn't be tolerated. Period.
Only other thing that bothered me yesterday in the dialogue on the local sports talk shops was around comparing Hardy to Brent and which was worse. Do we really need to try and grade disgustingly bad behavior in terms of which is worse? That's almost the same as comparing Pancreatic Cancer to Esophageal Cancer. They both suck.
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 18, 2015 15:08:00 GMT -5
Done deal. One year with a potential of $13.1M. Cap hit for 2015 is $2.6M... He will be a FA in 2016.
Basically a "show me" deal.
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Post by tnerb57 on Mar 18, 2015 19:23:03 GMT -5
I have some seriously mixed feelings on this. Dude can play. Absolutely no question about his on-field skills and ability to be a force on a team whose deficiencies in rushing the QB are well documented. It's an immediate upgrade and one that improves every facet of the defense... and - with the right addition of young players from the draft - could make our defense seriously formidable again with Marinelli running the show. The off-the-field stuff is there for everyone to see. It's reprehensible. The ESPN OTL report on his incident is beyond disturbing. He will be suspended once he signs with someone... and it almost has to be 6 games based on precedent alone. The fact that his coaches at Ol' Miss essentially told people scouting him before his draft that "you don't want this guy" is a searing indictment. He would appear to be everything you would walk away from under Garrett's statements and perspectives around "the right kind of guy" in the room. Personally - I'm OK with signing the guy. Place the proper verbiage in his contract that protects the team should he do something stupid... make it a "prove it" contract similar to what was given Melton last year. Get the agent (although I don't know that this is in Rosenhaus' DNA) to have his client attend some type of domestic abuse forum (whatever that might be) to see if he truly "gets it". Press on. I don't mind second chances as long as the recipient understands he or she isn't exempt from the norms of society. And - domestic abuse shouldn't be tolerated. Period. Only other thing that bothered me yesterday in the dialogue on the local sports talk shops was around comparing Hardy to Brent and which was worse. Do we really need to try and grade disgustingly bad behavior in terms of which is worse? That's almost the same as comparing Pancreatic Cancer to Esophageal Cancer. They both suck. What have I got to do with any of this??? Oh wait. Josh Brent. Carry on. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 18, 2015 19:24:31 GMT -5
I have some seriously mixed feelings on this. Dude can play. Absolutely no question about his on-field skills and ability to be a force on a team whose deficiencies in rushing the QB are well documented. It's an immediate upgrade and one that improves every facet of the defense... and - with the right addition of young players from the draft - could make our defense seriously formidable again with Marinelli running the show. The off-the-field stuff is there for everyone to see. It's reprehensible. The ESPN OTL report on his incident is beyond disturbing. He will be suspended once he signs with someone... and it almost has to be 6 games based on precedent alone. The fact that his coaches at Ol' Miss essentially told people scouting him before his draft that "you don't want this guy" is a searing indictment. He would appear to be everything you would walk away from under Garrett's statements and perspectives around "the right kind of guy" in the room. Personally - I'm OK with signing the guy. Place the proper verbiage in his contract that protects the team should he do something stupid... make it a "prove it" contract similar to what was given Melton last year. Get the agent (although I don't know that this is in Rosenhaus' DNA) to have his client attend some type of domestic abuse forum (whatever that might be) to see if he truly "gets it". Press on. I don't mind second chances as long as the recipient understands he or she isn't exempt from the norms of society. And - domestic abuse shouldn't be tolerated. Period. Only other thing that bothered me yesterday in the dialogue on the local sports talk shops was around comparing Hardy to Brent and which was worse. Do we really need to try and grade disgustingly bad behavior in terms of which is worse? That's almost the same as comparing Pancreatic Cancer to Esophageal Cancer. They both suck. I guess "you're the right kind of guy in the room" if you can rush the passer.  |
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Otis B. Driftwood
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I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it.
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 18, 2015 20:58:05 GMT -5
Done deal. One year with a potential of $13.1M. Cap hit for 2015 is $2.6M... He will be a FA in 2016. Basically a "show me" deal. There's only a $2.6 million cap hit on that $13.1? I wonder what happens when multiple players on a team meet enough incentives to cumulatively exceed the cap? Then the following year's cap is pretty well screwed I guess. |
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Post by Zig on Mar 18, 2015 21:00:25 GMT -5
I wouldn't have been pissed if the Pats signed him
most of these guys arent exactly choir boys...to paraphrase the Big Tuna
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Macho Row
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Post by Macho Row on Mar 19, 2015 6:52:46 GMT -5
750k in base salary. 9.25 in bonuses. This may be some sort of record.
How that works out to a cap hit of just over 3 is beyond me.
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 19, 2015 7:31:54 GMT -5
750k in base salary. 9.25 in bonuses. This may be some sort of record. How that works out to a cap hit of just over 3 is beyond me. Breakdown of his contract - from the Dallas Morning News; Greg Hardy signed an incentive-laden one-year contract with no guaranteed money that prohibits the Cowboys from placing the franchise or transition tag on him in 2016. His cap number is estimated to be $3.2 million.
Salary: $745,000 - Roster Bonus: $578,437 per game - Workout Bonus: $1.31 million Incentives - 8 sacks: $500,000 - or 10 sacks: $1 million - or 12 sacks: $1.4 million - or 14 sacks: $1.804 million Max Incentives: 1.804 million Maximum Possible Value: $13.1 million I'm still trying to figure out the $3.2M number. But most of the "bonus" numbers fall into the "uncertain to achieve" category (because of the pending suspension I suspect). That's why they don't count against 2015. They would be applied to 2016. |
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Macho Row
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Post by Macho Row on Mar 19, 2015 7:51:20 GMT -5
750k in base salary. 9.25 in bonuses. This may be some sort of record. How that works out to a cap hit of just over 3 is beyond me. Breakdown of his contract - from the Dallas Morning News; Greg Hardy signed an incentive-laden one-year contract with no guaranteed money that prohibits the Cowboys from placing the franchise or transition tag on him in 2016. His cap number is estimated to be $3.2 million.
Salary: $745,000 - Roster Bonus: $578,437 per game - Workout Bonus: $1.31 million Incentives - 8 sacks: $500,000 - or 10 sacks: $1 million - or 12 sacks: $1.4 million - or 14 sacks: $1.804 million Max Incentives: 1.804 million Maximum Possible Value: $13.1 million I'm still trying to figure out the $3.2M number. But most of the "bonus" numbers fall into the "uncertain to achieve" category (because of the pending suspension I suspect). That's why they don't count against 2015. They would be applied to 2016. That clears it up a bit.
So I suppose what I need to root for is no suspension and a monster year. Then after the season a suspension come so its all dead money and no contract can be worked out to shuffle around and delay some of that dead money.
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 19, 2015 9:04:38 GMT -5
Breakdown of his contract - from the Dallas Morning News; Greg Hardy signed an incentive-laden one-year contract with no guaranteed money that prohibits the Cowboys from placing the franchise or transition tag on him in 2016. His cap number is estimated to be $3.2 million.
Salary: $745,000 - Roster Bonus: $578,437 per game - Workout Bonus: $1.31 million Incentives - 8 sacks: $500,000 - or 10 sacks: $1 million - or 12 sacks: $1.4 million - or 14 sacks: $1.804 million Max Incentives: 1.804 million Maximum Possible Value: $13.1 million I'm still trying to figure out the $3.2M number. But most of the "bonus" numbers fall into the "uncertain to achieve" category (because of the pending suspension I suspect). That's why they don't count against 2015. They would be applied to 2016. That clears it up a bit.
So I suppose what I need to root for is no suspension and a monster year. Then after the season a suspension come so its all dead money and no contract can be worked out to shuffle around and delay some of that dead money.
Good luck with that. He's getting at least 4. I'd damn near lay odds on 6.
At the very worst, the Cowboys would be on the hook for $9M in 2016. I'm "guessing" it'll be closer to $6M - tops. Right now, they are at $110M for 2016 (based on "Over The Cap") with Dez's contract still to be done... as well as whatever the renegotiate for Carr (he's taking a pay cut this season - one way or another) adds to it. They'll still have enough to get Frederick resigned and work on a new deal for Martin. And - they still won't have to touch Romo's contract to do any of that (in spite of what that assclown Schefter was saying yesterday on the local espen affiliate). And - if the test drive goes OK with no ill effects (read - if Hardy gets his shit together off the field) - the Cowboys could possibly sign the dude long term.
Maybe you could hope for that... 
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Post by Hank Kingsley on Mar 19, 2015 10:33:10 GMT -5
A needed asset for sure.
But a peckerwood.
I have mixed emotions.
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 19, 2015 14:31:21 GMT -5
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 19, 2015 14:36:23 GMT -5
Let me say this about Mr. Hansen... The absolute LAST person who should be having any type of diatribes with regard to moral standards is him. He was also one of the leading voices lambasting Jimmy Johnson in 1989 over the Herschel Walker trade... and couldn't polish Jimmy's appendage quick enough when they were winning Super Bowls as well as when the Jimmy/Jerry divorce happened. He made his living with breaking the SMU scandal in the 80's. That's pretty much it. There are plenty of credible voices in the Dallas media. He's not one of them. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 19, 2015 14:45:37 GMT -5
Let me say this about Mr. Hansen... The absolute LAST person who should be having any type of diatribes with regard to moral standards is him. He was also one of the leading voices lambasting Jimmy Johnson in 1989 over the Herschel Walker trade... and couldn't polish Jimmy's appendage quick enough when they were winning Super Bowls as well as when the Jimmy/Jerry divorce happened. He made his living with breaking the SMU scandal in the 80's. That's pretty much it. There are plenty of credible voices in the Dallas media. He's not one of them. I don't know the man, in fact I've never heard of him but he's fairly good at pointing out the hypocrisy of this hire. That's all I'm saying. If what he says is untrue then that's a different story but I do not believe it is. And if this is the type of person the Cowboys want to have around that's fine too. Just don't talk out the other side of your mouth about "the right kind of people" unless it's women beaters you actually want on your team. |
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 19, 2015 18:16:05 GMT -5
Let me say this about Mr. Hansen... The absolute LAST person who should be having any type of diatribes with regard to moral standards is him. He was also one of the leading voices lambasting Jimmy Johnson in 1989 over the Herschel Walker trade... and couldn't polish Jimmy's appendage quick enough when they were winning Super Bowls as well as when the Jimmy/Jerry divorce happened. He made his living with breaking the SMU scandal in the 80's. That's pretty much it. There are plenty of credible voices in the Dallas media. He's not one of them. I don't know the man, in fact I've never heard of him but he's fairly good at pointing out the hypocrisy of this hire. That's all I'm saying. If what he says is untrue then that's a different story but I do not believe it is. And if this is the type of person the Cowboys want to have around that's fine too. Just don't talk out the other side of your mouth about "the right kind of people" unless it's women beaters you actually want on your team. And - if it were Jason Garrett making the decision to sign Hardy, then you would have a legitimate point regarding "right kind of people" in the room. It wasn't him. This is as big a Jerry hire as there is... exactly the same kind of signing as when he brought Owens in here. Had Hansen kept it to Jones, then I would probably be OK with his comments. But - his attack on Garrett crossed the line... as did his attack on Garrett's dad. That was unnecessary. I can assure you of this - he damn sure didn"t call Bill Parcells a puppet when TO was brought here. It's well known here that Hansen despises Jerrah. It's also well known here that the only one with a larger ego than Jerry is Hansen. That's why I stay very leery of anything he says. Kinda like the leering press up there that hold you guys hostage with To***to stuff. It's all about objectivity - or a lack thereof. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 19, 2015 18:30:29 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules.  |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 19, 2015 18:35:54 GMT -5
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Otis B. Driftwood
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I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it.
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 19, 2015 18:48:00 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules. Those are the rules. Such is the life of the Cowboys fan. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 19, 2015 18:57:19 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules. Those are the rules. Such is the life of the Cowboys fan. Then I'm good.  |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Mar 19, 2015 22:25:09 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules. Obviously not following the Ravens new agenda get arrested get cut |
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Otis B. Driftwood
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I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it.
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 20, 2015 6:43:44 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules. Obviously not following the Ravens new agenda get arrested get cut Let's see what happens if Joe Flacco gets arrested. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 20, 2015 10:38:34 GMT -5
So what I'm hearing is Jerrah will do whatever the fuck he wants (well we knew that) and we're not to believe anything Garrett says because he doesn't speak for the Cowboys? I'm good with that just as long as I know the rules. Obviously not following the Ravens new agenda get arrested get cut But Greg doesn't look like a convicted felon.....
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Mar 20, 2015 10:47:04 GMT -5
Obviously not following the Ravens new agenda get arrested get cut Let's see what happens if Joe Flacco gets arrested. Bet they at least get rid of the guaranteed in his contract |
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Post by EWA Beach PGH Fan on Mar 20, 2015 11:26:23 GMT -5
Let's see what happens if Joe Flacco gets arrested. Bet they at least get rid of the guaranteed in his contract I'm sure they'd at least try to. But Flacco would have to agree since it's a signed deal. Course, if he gets arrested he may have no choice but agree to renegociate the guaranteed money out of his contract and perhaps a pay cut too if he wanted to stay a Raven. I will also say, if Flacco was ever arrested it would be the biggest surprise of the year cause he's about as exciting as dirt off the field. Not that anything is ever impossible but him getting arrested is about as close as you can get. |
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Post by Swamp Dragon on Mar 20, 2015 13:16:18 GMT -5
Bet they at least get rid of the guaranteed in his contract I'm sure they'd at least try to. But Flacco would have to agree since it's a signed deal. Course, if he gets arrested he may have no choice but agree to renegociate the guaranteed money out of his contract and perhaps a pay cut too if he wanted to stay a Raven. I will also say, if Flacco was ever arrested it would be the biggest surprise of the year cause he's about as exciting as dirt off the field. Not that anything is ever impossible but him getting arrested is about as close as you can get. There are provisions in contracts that void guaranteed money due to suspensions arrests etc |
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Post by EWA Beach PGH Fan on Mar 20, 2015 13:51:38 GMT -5
I'm sure they'd at least try to. But Flacco would have to agree since it's a signed deal. Course, if he gets arrested he may have no choice but agree to renegociate the guaranteed money out of his contract and perhaps a pay cut too if he wanted to stay a Raven. I will also say, if Flacco was ever arrested it would be the biggest surprise of the year cause he's about as exciting as dirt off the field. Not that anything is ever impossible but him getting arrested is about as close as you can get. There are provisions in contracts that void guaranteed money due to suspensions arrests etc There is also the Personal Conduct Policy clause that's in every NFL contract. But in order for some of those provision to kick in the player has to be cut by the team first. I know this was an issue when the Ravens cut Ray Rice last year. If he was suspended by the league when he was cut I think they didn't have to pay him his guaranteed money for that year but if he wasn't then they were on the hook for his agreed to guaranteed salary plus bonus for the year. That's why Ray appealed his year suspension which he won. Cap implications also come into play. If I'm rememeber it right, Benard Pierce's salary and bonus still count against the cap this year whether he's paid them or not. Which is probably why a lower salary guy like Pierce is just cut when he goofs up but a higher salary player like Flacco requires a different tactic. And, I have no idea what's Pierce's signing by Jacksonville has on the Ravens cap. |
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Otis B. Driftwood
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 26, 2015 7:18:24 GMT -5
Garrett's comments from yesterday... "I spoke with him for probably two or three hours. I told him at the outset, 'I'm going to be honest with you, I expect you to be honest with me. We're not recruiting you. We're finding out about you.'" "At the end, we decided we could bring him in under the right circumstances. The conditions of the contract were important. No guaranteed money. Earn it every step of the way. If at any point we don't like what he’s doing as a player or a person, we can move on without any salary-cap consequences." "We're all a work in progress. We're all trying to be the right kind of guys. Not everybody is a finished product. We have brought in players in years past where you might have said, 'He's not the best guy.' We created the right environment, and players responded. Other times we tried to do the same thing, and guys didn’t respond and it didn't work. It’s my job as head coach to create the right environment for coaches and for players. He has to respond to it. If he does, it's a good thing for us and it's good for him. If not, we move on with our football team. We're going to approach this on a day-to-day basis." The Dallas Morning NewsExactly what I want to hear from the coach of my team. Now - whether Jerry undercuts him or not remains to be seen. Lord knows he's prone to that. But Garrett is setting the proper tone here. |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 26, 2015 8:58:26 GMT -5
Garrett's comments from yesterday... "I spoke with him for probably two or three hours. I told him at the outset, 'I'm going to be honest with you, I expect you to be honest with me. We're not recruiting you. We're finding out about you.'" "At the end, we decided we could bring him in under the right circumstances. The conditions of the contract were important. No guaranteed money. Earn it every step of the way. If at any point we don't like what he’s doing as a player or a person, we can move on without any salary-cap consequences." "We're all a work in progress. We're all trying to be the right kind of guys. Not everybody is a finished product. We have brought in players in years past where you might have said, 'He's not the best guy.' We created the right environment, and players responded. Other times we tried to do the same thing, and guys didn’t respond and it didn't work. It’s my job as head coach to create the right environment for coaches and for players. He has to respond to it. If he does, it's a good thing for us and it's good for him. If not, we move on with our football team. We're going to approach this on a day-to-day basis." The Dallas Morning NewsExactly what I want to hear from the coach of my team. Now - whether Jerry undercuts him or not remains to be seen. Lord knows he's prone to that. But Garrett is setting the proper tone here. That's all well and good Otis but it's just spin. While Garrett's is "setting the proper tone" he's also setting a new one. Now he's saying, "we'll create the right environment and hopefully this piece of garbage comes around and gets 15 sacks and everybody forgets he's a convicted felon."
Sorry not buying it.
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Otis B. Driftwood
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I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it.
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Post by Otis B. Driftwood on Mar 26, 2015 11:27:54 GMT -5
Garrett's comments from yesterday... "I spoke with him for probably two or three hours. I told him at the outset, 'I'm going to be honest with you, I expect you to be honest with me. We're not recruiting you. We're finding out about you.'" "At the end, we decided we could bring him in under the right circumstances. The conditions of the contract were important. No guaranteed money. Earn it every step of the way. If at any point we don't like what he’s doing as a player or a person, we can move on without any salary-cap consequences." "We're all a work in progress. We're all trying to be the right kind of guys. Not everybody is a finished product. We have brought in players in years past where you might have said, 'He's not the best guy.' We created the right environment, and players responded. Other times we tried to do the same thing, and guys didn’t respond and it didn't work. It’s my job as head coach to create the right environment for coaches and for players. He has to respond to it. If he does, it's a good thing for us and it's good for him. If not, we move on with our football team. We're going to approach this on a day-to-day basis." The Dallas Morning NewsExactly what I want to hear from the coach of my team. Now - whether Jerry undercuts him or not remains to be seen. Lord knows he's prone to that. But Garrett is setting the proper tone here. That's all well and good Otis but it's just spin. While Garrett's is "setting the proper tone" he's also setting a new one. Now he's saying, "we'll create the right environment and hopefully this piece of garbage comes around and gets 15 sacks and everybody forgets he's a convicted felon."
Sorry not buying it.
Well - Can't very well say "Jerry is a fucking idiot and I'm stuck with coaching this complete piece of shit human being"... can he? |
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Post by Canuck eh? on Mar 26, 2015 14:17:23 GMT -5
That's all well and good Otis but it's just spin. While Garrett's is "setting the proper tone" he's also setting a new one. Now he's saying, "we'll create the right environment and hopefully this piece of garbage comes around and gets 15 sacks and everybody forgets he's a convicted felon."
Sorry not buying it.
Well - Can't very well say "Jerry is a fucking idiot and I'm stuck with coaching this complete piece of shit human being"... can he? Perhaps say nothing instead of looking like a puppet fool? |
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